Surely, there are “giant killers” but, generally speaking, how does price assure one of getting relatively comparable quality? High value applies to many. What do you consider “giant killers”?
Only knowing yourself and how you listen really helps here.
The most modern tools and materials may go in a direction that doesn't actually bring you joy. What good is a pure diamond speaker cabinet if the end result is not what you want to listen to all night?
For the companies that price their products according to the cost to manufacture, it can reflect the quality of the parts used. But there have been products made using the best parts available, and (some) people still don't like how they sound.
Then there are companies that set their prices according to what they think the market will bear. That is a reflection of their understanding of the market more than anything else.
The largest factor in the quality of a product is the talent and knowledge of the designer, a difficult thing to quantify, and a subjective matter.
I did recently replace a $3K preamp with one for $599. They sounded the same as the $3K preamp with the same mono amp I was using. So I was happy, and I sold the $3K preamp for almost what I bought it for. Even happier.
However, I have 2 other amps that are totally useless (incompatible) with the $599 preamp. So in some ways I am getting what I paid for. A little sadder now.
At any given price, once you find the best component at that price the next better one will cost more. That's the relationship.
When you find the best component at any given price, and there is a better one but it costs 2x, 3x or more, that is a contender for giant killer. When it sounds good enough there are people who find it competitive with some of the very best regardless of price, then you definitely have a giant killer.
yes, there is some great low cost stuff, some not so good high cost stuff, of course the issue of component matching...though I have always found the gear I like the best costs more...
There is a strong correlation between price and sound quality, but it's definitely not 100%. Many lower priced components outperform similar more expensive components. It's worth noting that price is always influenced by factors such as mark up, labor costs, shipping, taxes/tariffs etc. so a higher price does not automatically mean a better design and better components.
In addition, "sound quality" is rather vague as it is subjective, and that also plays into this.
That said, those who claim their $2 flex sounds the same as a $2,000 cable is either totally disingenuous and/or deaf, and that is why you will see the same tiresome individuals making such claims. What's notable about their claims as they never explain their findings in terms of listening to the cables, but always in the context of their 4th grade understanding of science and psychology.
Budget audiophiles desperately need "giant killers " in a vain attempt to offset the fact that they are nowhere near SOTA. They need to believe whatever they use is a giant killer. It's the culture of the price-obsessed listener. :)
Sound quality is extremely subjective, so it's tough to correlate price with what you like. Higher price should at least buy more luxurious aesthetics, and/or more expensive base components.
bdp24 has it right. In general build quality goes up with price but performance after a point does not. Once you get to the best electrical components the builders of "luxury" equipment start adding filigree like CNCed chassis and gold screws. Given that dealer mark up is generally a percentage of the cost the price goes sky rocketing. The best values are in the middle somewhere and sometimes they are phenomenal like The Parasound JC1 and 1+, reasonably priced amps that thump many of the megabuck amps. Sound Labs speakers are another great example. Many of us think these speakers are the ultimate regardless of price and they are $200,000 less than their competitors. The Channel D Lino C phono stage for $2600.00 another giant killer.
Budget audiophiles desperately need "giant killers " in a vain attempt to offset the fact that they are nowhere near SOTA. They need to believe whatever they use is a giant killer. It's the culture of the price-obsessed listener. :)
Once again the master speaks. You minions with your Panasonic shelf systems aren't worthy. Bow down now, lest ye be struck by his might.......
Good sound need only cost more for certain when you need more of it like in rare cases with very large rooms in a handful of houses. Then there are the cases of truly large public venues that also target good sound quality. They need the most and also are most motivated to find ways to do it cost effectively. As opposed to hobbyists who get enjoyment as much out of tinkering and throwing money into the hobby in pursuit of “better sound” as much as they do merely enjoying music. It’s all good. Just not equally cost effective. Not to mention it’s hard to get people to even agree on what better sound is when they hear it. That’s why there are so many options and people do it so many different ways. Variety is the spice of life whereas the ultimate sound is a pipe dream except each may have their own conception of what the ultimate sound is for them. If they care about the best sound possible (for them) they need to. You can’t hit the target if you don’t know where it is.
@mapman " You can’t hit the target if you don’t know where it is."
Truer words were never spoken. How do you know what a stereo is capable of sounding like if you have never heard one perform at that level? Just as you have stated sound quality can be all over the map for stereos and live performances. But, in my experience when faced by a really excellent system everyone will agree that it is an excellent system. Once you hear it you are in serious trouble. I remember vividly the first time I heard such a system. My system at the time was no slouch but it did not come close to doing what this system did and it was not at the store either, but at the apartment of a hermit high school teacher in Miami who stubbornly like driving Alphas. I thought my system was imaging at the state of the art until I heard this. It took me ten years and lord knows how much money to replicate it. It can certainly be done for about $100,000 in todays money and that includes a turntable. I suspect it can be done for considerably less. There are people who pay more for just a turntable! If there is better I have not heard it yet. I have never heard it at a show either.
I'd say there is a loose relationship between price and build quality (e.g. quality of parts used, level of construction, tolerance...etc), but this doesn't equate to sound quality, which is most important to us. So overall, there isn't a clear correlation between price and overall quality as judged by the end user. Is a 10K phono stage 5x better than a 2K phono stage? How would one even determine or quantify it is objectively better?
Money can't buy you happiness but it sure can my a lot of misery! I have said this so many times here on Agon. Get to know what parts make a difference in sound. Price has nothing to do with sound or quality unless the component is designed well. I have a old Lafayette KT-550 tube power amp that probably sounds better than most amps built today. No special parts but transformers are excellent. Go Figure.
@bigkidz , in the absence of a greater misery money sure can buy you happiness and security. However, you only need so much and there are people who really need help.
Buy the best product you can afford and stop coveting what you can't have or begrudge those who can afford to pay more for what they perceive as better. It's all relative.
“Moneycan’tbuyhappiness, But it couldbuy meaboat, it couldbuymea truck to pull it, It couldbuymea Yeti 110 iced down with some silver bullets”…it’s all relative.
As you grow and mature in this hobby, you learn through experiences what sounds good to you and usually at lower costs because NO ONE spends 100k on their first system, LOL. Once you learn what makes audio gear sound great to you, usually, one will try to seek sound qualities they like in equipment as they swap, trade, sell, or buy other stuff in their journey to audio bliss. Quality may increase with more costly items; however, not always. Think thin metal bezel or plastic and thin gauge chassis for some things at lower costs while higher costs products may have thicker gauge chassis and copper reinforcement. This adds to the cost and may or may not increase ones perceived notion of better sound. Technically speaking, how does a .001 THD product compare to a .0001 product in terms of listening? A more costly product will usually yield better specs, but how does that translate to the subjective and perceived sound that is output to a listener? As others have stated, more costly does not necessarily equal better sound. But, if one were to take the time and look for quality products and listen to them, then it is highly feasible that higher cost products will have better quality or different sound, but at what cost?
At the end of the day, in this hobby,you have to gain experience, and learn from others to understand the cost/quality quotient of audio products that others speak of. They have been there done that. The perceived luxury of an item due to its cost is something that is in all industries. In reality, once you establish an individual benchmark for value versus quality, that is your “giant killer” range. So what’s your number? Others may have higher or lower.
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