Bumping this old thread.. I'm looking for the best tube preamp for the $ and it's looking like even in 2021 the Schitt Freya + is still the gold standard. The other great thing about the Schitt is they sell immediate on the secondary market so it's risk free to try them out.
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What's meant by 'New Age'? Dueter is 'new age', but his early albums are less so... Michael Rother did some new age stuff, but his albums are mostly just cool (excluding the polydor era...). Steve Roach is considered New Age, but in the last 15 years or so his stuff has gotten really interesting (and challenging to some systems)... but to this day one of his new age 80s classics 'Dreamtime Return' has a favorite cut that is somehow still quite interesting (to me- nice to play after coming home from work).... I think he did most of that on a Prophet 5 (but that is only my surmise based on the sounds I'm hearing on this cut): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y4CVTeqboSo |
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I recently bought the Doge 8 Clarity (2019 Edition) preamp. It is a very comprehensive preamp with 5 line level inputs, MM/MC phono, tape/headphone out, 2 volume-controlled outputs, and a high-quality metal remote control. It is RCA only - no balanced inputs or outputs. Once I installed outstanding 12AT7s into the line stage (I chose 1982 Siemens ECC801S tubes, but the other highly recommended alternative is new Russian copy Genalex Gold Lion B579 tubes), and gave the preamp 300+ hours of (absolutely essential) burn-in time, I've ended up with a line-level preamp which is phenomenal, at a price which is absurdly low, given this preamp's spectacular transparency and build quality. My holographic JLTi power amp can be switched to be an integrated amp, so it is possible for me to evaluate the Doge against almost no preamp at all! The difference in realism between running the JLTi on its own as an integrated, or adding the Doge in line to the JLTi, is remarkably small. This is one hell of a line level preamp, and that's before I've even considered its MC phono stage (I already have a superb MM/MC phono preamp). It may not be the world's ABSOLUTE BEST preamp, but it is the best line preamp I have EVER heard at any price! It is only available direct from the Doge factory in China. Price INCLUDING shipping to most countries is US$1495! |
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If you are looking for best pre amp with no cost barrier. I recommend this http://www.silbatoneacoustics.com/refpre.html It use exquisite NOS tube hard to get. The sound is transparent and mesmerizing with Jazz Vocal. If you visit Munich Audio show, then you can listen to it. |
The Schiit Freya I own is an amazingly great sounding preamp, has features no other preamp has (switching between passive, FET, and tubes even remotely, and a sophisticated and accurate attenuator), includes plenty of balanced and single ended inputs and outputs, and is embarrassingly (to other gear manufacturers) inexpensive for a USA made product. The best? Of course! Does it belong in the "speaker" category? Of course not. |
The best, in a cost is no object system, would have to match my taste, my other components and my operating requirements (remote control, balance control, etc.). That can be done best by finding a builder who makes stuff that sounds good to you and having that builder then make a custom linestage/preamp that specifically fits your requirements. I had the builder of my linestage put in remote control of volume and a balance control. I also opted for transformer outputs that match the transformer inputs of my amp (other buyers from this builder have opted for capacitor-coupled outputs or having both types of outputs). I have also seen and heard other interesting linestages from other custom builders includes some with highly unusual features, such as a two-way crossover. |
Super Old Thread, but similar seekers may want to check out the MP-3 Fully Loaded or even better the MP-1 from Atma-Sphere. I would highly recommend the Caddock Resistors and Vcap Upgrades. The MP-1 Pre-amp is a Destination Pre-amp for me it can easily run circles on pre-amps that cost 3-4 times higher. We are talking about a 26K Pre-amp (Fully Loaded with Phono). The MP-3 is a small contender which fully loaded will give at least 90% of the performance at much less hit on your wallet. |
Even though this is an old thread, gear changes as does what is available to us all after a few years of depreciation and new entry's. I would add a different take to "the best" from a tight budget perspective versus hi end models. I've had the opportunity to demo or own Classe CP500, ARC LS17se, Modwright SWL9.0se, BAT VK3i, Canary 980 and Pass Labs X1. My humble little semi-custom YS Audio A2 Balanced Gold preamp is the unit to beat at a meager $1,600 brand new. You can tube roll the heck out of it and it rewards with dividends. Fully balanced, zero negative feedback, tons of XLR connections, balance/gain and remote. One literally would have to spend over $6,000 to beat what this preamp can provide to your system. Cheers and Happy New Year! |
The Ypsilon stuff is the best I have ever heard, the phono pre the linestage and the stepups represent a wide degree of seperation from the rest of the crowd. Black blackgrounds, tremendous speed, linearity and balance, coupled with tremendous levels of separation and refinement. Throw massive orchestral movements at it and they just resolve everything with such finesse and grace it leaves you startled. Scary good. I do not own any Ypsilon gear as it is above my pay grade, but if I could afford it I would. I am fortunate that I have a friend who does own this gear and I get to hear it compared to lots of other gear. It is truly light years ahead of everything else. Because of that it comes with a hefty price tag. Unfortunately. As of this date it just may be the best preamp. If there is such a thing as "best". |
Thanks Charlesdad for your comments. I have heard good things about the Coincident preamp and it was one I set out to beat in my design. DHT preamps are where it is at. Once you hear one, it is hard to go back. The first one my partner and I build was a two chassis design but the parts used in that preamp are no longer available so I had to source replacement parts. There was nothing I ever heard that compared to it. I can only express the sound in this way, if you poured a cup of water into a garden hose and then a cup of water into a two foot diameter pipe, the water would flow without any issues in either one but you probably would not even know the water was in the two foot diameter pipe. That is the way music flowed out of the two chassis design. Music just flowed so unrestricted and musical without any stress, everyone wanted one. I just could not source the parts to make one under $10K. I tried too many to mention (transformers and chokes), had some custom ones built and now we build them ourselves. It has been a long time getting to this point where I can source parts that I need to produce a consistent product. I use a 226 or you can use the 101D tube. I really want to hear a pair of Western Electric 101D tubes but too pricey for me. The 101D tubes used in the Coincident where just OK sounding compared to the 226 tube for my tastes but to each his own and you can swap them out without any issues in my design. The custom transformer that we now make really made a big difference in overall sound quality. You would never know it except in direct comparison. My partner and I were impressed that this happened and it will be what sets us apart from our competition. In addition, we will be the only company making a preamp where you can adjust the sound of the preamp by turning a selector switch. When trying to figure out the final parts design of the preamp, I had to choose the final parts section. Some parts seemed more open, some better soundstage and placement, some more musical, some more dynamic with better resolution. I spend months listening to these select parts, keeping notes, asking other audiophiles for their opinions, etc. I set up the prototype with a selector switch so that I could change between the parts, much simpler then soldering them in and out. It then dawned on me to keep the selector switch and let the consumer decide on what sound they preferred. It also helps with different recordings. Some are better than others, brighter, softer, etc. So now the consumer can select the sound they want or switch the sound anytime. It may change the way consumers value interconnects! Cables make less of a difference in my opinion with DHT preamps and so far the preamp and selection switch offers more than any interconnects I have tried. All this being said, have we built best preamp ever, no but it sure beats the pants of all of the mass produced preamps we have compared it to. Anyone in the NYC area feel free to contact me and we can arrange for you to hear one in your system. Anyone in an audio club interested please feel free to also contact me to audition. The final chassis should be done within the next four to six weeks but I have prototypes to audition now. Happy Listening. |
Markgarmaise, I`ve owned the Coincident Statement Linestage for nearly 3 years and it`s stunning! Really an outstanding product,but it is`nt possible to claim any thing the 'best' IMO. There are too many variables involved and people simply hear things differently. The design by Israel Blume is brilliant in it`s purist approach.No resistor or capacitor in the signal path,transformer volume control,hard wired etc. Music is reproduced as organic,pure and natural as one could ever desire.This linestage uses the 101D(DHT tubes)which is a transparent and beautiful sounding tube. Bigkidz, your linestage sounds like it could be something special also. Good Luck, |
Markgarmaise, the Coincident is similar to what I manufacturer but my product uses custom wound transformers and chokes. In direct comparison, the custom wound parts are superior in resolution, detail, soundstage, bass and extension of high frequencies. So knowing how good the Coincident preamp is, my preamp should be superior but I have not done a direct side by side comparison to date. Rgs92, to be honest, most manufacturers uses cheap parts in production. The smaller manufacturers tent to use better parts as we do not build multiple units every day. I am amazed at the poor parts quality and design from many of the mass produced products. For example, wires with low and high voltage run right next to each other, cheap metal for a chassis with no dampening material, caps, transformers, chokes and attenuators. This is the reason there are so many people offering upgrades or modifications these days. That being said, modifications are more than just swapping out parts. You have to know the product and listen to each upgrade to know how much each will change the sound. In my preamp, I use a transformer volume control. My designs does not use any resistors in the attenuator to degrade the sound and I do not use any caps in the signal path to degrade the sound. I have also found that many of the recommendations on parts swapping from Audiogon members are useless. There are many who feel the Dact attenuator is a very god sounding attenuator but in my comparisons it is average sounding and the resistors used in it are nothing special based on long term listening tests in the same unit, same system, etc. Unfortunately, all of this adds to the cost of building a unit that the mass produced companies cannot do. Happy Listening. |
I am just about finished with my DHT preamp. If anyone in the local NYC area wants to hear what this preamp can do in their system, let me know. I think you will be very suprised on what you hear. Shoot me an email and we can arragne a meeting to hear it. [email protected] Peter |
Personally, I think it is more important to find the "best dealer" ever with an appropriate selection with whom you can work to put together a synergistic system. Having only heard what was at the time the entry point into the Ayon brand, the Spirit-1, I would love to hear their Spheris-II preamp along with their Orthos-II monoblocks, or the Vulcan-II. |
I have different tubes in every input, in the buffer (?) stage I only have 6H23. That way, I can have different flavor by simply moving cables to a different input jack. It is very sensitive to tube rolling, best I have heard was pinch waist I borrowed from a friend. I could not justify the price so instead I use the "2nd" tier tubes which elevate the already world class Einstein to another level. |
My list had trickled down to: VTL 7.5 or 6.5 VAC MK3 Eistein MKii It seemed the VTL would be a better value overall, but man, it looked like a 1980s VCR. I was seduced by the German Eistein MKii looks and the amazing reviews that were out there about this preamp. I was not able to find anywhere to audition these where I live, so I had to go with what people have been saying about these and my own liking, mainly down to the looks in addition to the performance. Long story short, I pulled the trigger on a used Eistein MKii that was listed here in Audiogon. This is going to be my firs high-end component entering my system, curious to see how it will change things. I hope I have not made a 8k mistake. My next move is to send my Oppo-95 to Modwright to get the tube upgrade. Meanwhile, I can't wait to get my new preamp. Will post some first impressions when it arrives. |
I own two preamps and one linestage and I cannot really decide which is the "best" among the three, never mind the whole universe of products. Each has its strengths and weaknesses. The most detailed, dynamic and extended in frequency response is the Emotive Audio Epifania (linestage), the one with the most musically seductive midrange (but with less control in the bass and less extension on top) is a custom built preamp using Western Electric input and output transformers, and easily the least sonically appealing is a Levinson Ref. No. 32 preamp (but I love the convenience features and incredible flexibility). I have not heard that many other contenders in my own system, but, I've heard many other great systems built around such linestages as the Atmasphere linestage, the Veloce linestage (can be configured as a preamp), the Audionote (uk) M-8 and M-10, the Kondo M-10, Burmester linestage, and a Shindo linestage. I can't say whether any of these are a "contender" because I haven't come close to hearing but a fraction of all linestages, and I am certain that quite a few that were in systems that did not impress me were not at fault. A number of great linestages I've heard were custom-built (essentially one-of-a kind, and not widely available). |
Best? There is no best. People nominate and "you" vote (elect) with your ears and wallet. Tube preamp: I nominate Conrad Johnson's top tube preamps as some of the best. For amps: Depending on the speaker, I'll campaign for Nelson Pass's XA.5 series in solid state. Tube amps? That's a tough one. Lots of good candidates and a lot depends again on the speaker. View the amp/speaker pair as one ticket (President/Vice President? Gotta stay the analogy). Of the brands you mentioned, I like the totl Sonus Fabers. Other possibilities for a SOTA system: OTL's with the right speaker. SET's with the right speaker. Planars with the right amp. Remember to have fun. |
There are a lot of folks who have owned very pricey, stratospheric preamps who now own TRL Dudes and say they will never have to look for another preamp again. I went through over a dozen mid-priced preamps and settled on the Dude and matching Samson amps. Off the carousel in those two departments now. |
Smoothjazz, Funny how one could own an MBL and then VAC...and think them comparable...how does MBL do what they do with solid state? Marvelous gear...and I totally agree with your VAC love...there's something simply musical about the VAC stuff...Kevin really does know what music sounds like...it's that simple. Admire your taste and envy your ownership. Larry |
