Speakers that sound like Usher Be-20s/10s


I am looking for speakers. I am a fan of the Usher sound - superb 3d soundstage, excellent leading edge dynamics, great attack and transients that make one jump out of the chair. I am considering the BE20s/10s in the used market but given their huge size and room requirements and low availability in the used market I am in two minds. Can anyone recommend a speaker that sounds similar? Especially previous Usher owners? I was considering Revel Salon 2s but got the impression that they are a little un-exciting and don't have a good attack (I may be mistaken)
My amp - Rotel 1090
Thanks!
Saum
sammisra
Haven't heard the Ushers you mention. But I can say that Salon 2s are far from non-dynamic, especially if you pair them with fast, high-current amplifiers that can keep up with them. Their soundstaging is also excellent and they have a large sweet spot.

At dealers they are often paired with amps from Harman stablemate Levinson. That pairing sounds great on acoustic or small combo material, but IMO is not as well suited for "big" music like orchestral works or rock with large dynamic swings.
I used to own the big Be-10s! Loved them. What is the your room size? I felt that the Focals sounded similar in terms of clarity and attack.
I would rather listen to Bose cubes than Usher BE, something about them that makes my ears hurt. Revel Salon 2 are polar opposite and a fine sounding speaker that I could listen to forever.
Thanks. The room size is 16*18*15(ceilings). I know it may be a little small for the 20s but maybe the ceiling can compensate..
I heard some big Ushers at a show some years back and was also very impressed. In terms of imaging the speakers they reminded me most of was Joseph Audio, but I can't speak to how they compare on the other parameters you mention. JA speakers sound very natural to me, but not sure if they have the jump factor, etc. you're looking for or not. Certainly worth a look imo.

In terms of dynamics and jump factor I might take a look at some PMC speakers. I think that powerful dome midrange driver might excel in that area, and from what I've read they image quite well too. The Evolution Acoustics MMMicroOne might be an interesting option too. Best of luck.
Thanks. I've heard good things about PMC. Also- The Evolution Acoustics MMMicro seems to be making quite a name but its just difficult to find a dealer even in New York, but worth a shot. Maybe I'll also give the Revels another listen
Hi everyone,

I own a pair of BE-10 and i can't find anything that can compare to it! Truing to find one for less is impossible.
Revel is overpriced for a non-interesting result. Comparing a BE-10 to the SALON is not fair for the revel...
The BE-10 is very transparent and the result can be really different considering the matching electronics and cables. I heard the BE-10 with PLINIUS mono blocks during the Munich high-end salon and it was pretty bad. The sound was too forward and flat due to the non musical PLINIUS system.
I use my BE-10 with MUSIC CULTURE electronics and it's quite amazing. My wires are ACROLINK, ANALYSIS PLUS (i'll upgrade to TARALABS OMEGA soon). The evidence is so clear to ears that you just go deeper into music.
I know the whole USHER range. BE-10 can only be compete by itself. If there is not many BE-10 on the second hand market, it should be the sign that nobody want to change it.
I compared the CP-8571 to the SASHA 3 and even at this price range, the USHER was superior in every way.
I think you've better stay in USHER AUDIO brand and try to find something at you're price range. The CP-6311 is an amazing low priced speaker cause it's very musical. Not the most detailed or sharp but music is very emotional with it.
What about Merlin;have you had a chance to listen to them?
"The sound was too forward and flat due to the non musical PLINIUS system."

You do realize that the Plinius amps you say you heard provide peak current of 50 amps (as opposed to the Music Culture's 20 amps)?

Sammisra, check out Marten Django XL. I had Ushers 8571 mk II a while ago - not bad for the money, but nothing special, having them, I always felt disconnect between midrange, highs and lows and they are very heavy.
The Martens Django XL in my house bested Ushers, Reference Grand Vienna, Sonus Faber Elipsa SE.
The only other speaker I liked a lot besides Martens in my system is Eaglston Andra II, still regret trading them.
10 and 20 are 2 of the worst speakers on the market
Go fish...................
First you have to undestand an be aware of the properties of your Rotel. Rotel is a 2-dimensional brand. It has only a little depth. For a deep and wide stage you need an amp which can do this. Rotel does not have these skills. All amps I test if they can give a 2 or 3-dimensional image. For me it is easy as 1 and 1 is 2.
Wc65mustang: Explain further please
Bol972's comments may be a tad hard to digest at times but I concur.
The Rotel wont do justice to the "somewhat beryllium" tweeters. Don't get me wrong, the Ushers sound very good even with a scandalous less than pure Be tweeter.
Woofers are hard to deal with. Like the Alto Utopia.
Can sound nasal with flabby bassif not driven right.
I hope people will open there eyes and ears. People have to learn to understand better what the properties/talents are of the stuff they own. I am not here to provoke. In the 15 years I am in this business I saw how often and easy people make misstakes cause of lack in knowledge in audio.
@P59teitel : i do know the differences between those amps but it didn't explain why it was so flat? Do you imply that the PLINIUS should drive speakers with too much depth to be good??? :))

@Denon1: I'm quite surprise on your impression on the CP-8571II? Dc d'apollito is behind every USHER AUDIO speakers and his work on phasis is flawless.
I don't know your electronics but if you had this impression on CP-8571, the Martens are probably messy enough to melt all frequencies together...
@P59teitel : i do know the differences between those amps but it didn't explain why it was so flat? Do you imply that the PLINIUS should drive speakers with too much depth to be good??? :))

@Denon1: I'm quite surprise on your impression on the CP-8571II? Dc d'apollito is behind every USHER AUDIO speakers and his work on phasis is flawless.
I don't know your electronics but if you had this impression on CP-8571, the Martens are probably messy enough to melt all frequencies together...
ROTEL is probably not the best Hifi brand on the market but it depends if you're talking about power amps, preamps, CD player... and it will also depend of the model, like in every brand on the market. Sometimes it's great on some models. Sometimes it's bad...
The ROTEL power amps are not so bad for the asking price. If you use a hybrid system with tube preamp and ROTEL power amp, you can be surprise.

About the USHER DMD tweeter, i'm still surprise when someone always write about the Beryllium percentage inside it ?! For the record, the DMD is no longer a Beryllium tweeter... Nevertheless, how can you measure the quality of a driver on the percentage of Beryllium inside it ?
USHER is probably the best brand on the market today for many reasons :
1 - They produce and develop their own drivers (DMD tweeter, Beryllium medium)
2 - They use the skills of dc d'apollito, M. Ritchie and 40 years of experience.
3 - The asking price is way below the competition for a better result.

I'm a professional for 20 years and i was always amazed how people can buy only on reputation or ego. When it comes to real sound, it's not an easy task to find something really emotional!
Many brands offer artificial highs (headache after 1 hour of listening), emphasis medium (majority), boomy low frequencies or no bass at all. USHER was a real slap when i discover the brand during an Hifi show. From the S-520 to the D-3, it's always perfectly in phase and a real deal for the price. And it makes music, not only frequencies.
MARTEN for example use a ceramic driver. It's too stiff to let music flow but great on transients. It depends what you like to ear : the sniffing man on the back of the sound stage or the emotion of the music.
And "knowing audio" doesn't mean a thing. Knowing technic and drivers are better informations to evaluate a speaker.
By "flat" I thought you meant non-dynamic. Do you mean something else?
Dynamic with no-control is probably the worst an amplifier can make!

Power is one thing, control of power is a complete different story. Many amplifier shows dynamic in one single wave (flat), some other throw the music in the face (forward). Rare are amplifiers with articulate dynamics that show how every instrument has his own life. I really think is the heart of a great Hifi system.

In my life, the only cheap brand that showed an incredible value for the price was MAGNUM (not Magnum dynalab), a small english brand now closed.

A rapid list of great amplifiers in order of price for me :
- NVA (English) : not the greatest neutrality but so vivid and enjoyable to listen to!
- TSAKIRIDIS Devices (Greece) : Tube amps phenomenal for the price!
- EXPOSURE : Not all the models are equally good.
- ODYSSEY : depending on models
- NAIM (english) : This brand is a closed sister of NVA...
- SYMPHONIC LINE (German) : expensive but very good
- MUSIC CULTURE (German): Extremely musical, fluid but even dynamic
I found the Plinius SB-301 I had in my system to have reasonable control along with good macro-dynamics. And it was a bass monster - low but tight. Where it fell a little short compared to better - and usually quite a bit more expensive - amps was in micro-dynamics and a bit of a rolled-off top end. But it will drive just about any load and holds its own in its price range.

"Rare are amplifiers with articulate dynamics that show how every instrument has his own life. I really think is the heart of a great Hifi system."

If by "articulate dynamics" you mean micro-dynamics then we agree that is very important.

"- SYMPHONIC LINE (German) : expensive but very good"

Indeed. Look at my system page. :)
I found the Plinius SB-301 I had in my system to have reasonable control along with good macro-dynamics. And it was a bass monster - low but tight. Where it fell a little short compared to better - and usually quite a bit more expensive - amps was in micro-dynamics and a bit of a rolled-off top end. But it will drive just about any load and holds its own in its price range.

"Rare are amplifiers with articulate dynamics that show how every instrument has his own life. I really think is the heart of a great Hifi system."

If by "articulate dynamics" you mean micro-dynamics then we agree that is very important.

"- SYMPHONIC LINE (German) : expensive but very good"

Indeed. Look at my system page. :)
@P59teitel : I think PLINIUS Amps can find his way on "hard to drive" speakers like old BW 800 serie or some MAGICO and WILSON AUDIO. On BE-10 (easiest to drive), it was too much for a bad result. Anyway it was not really emotional kind of amps, just a powerful SS with no subtilities.

SYMPHONIC LINE is really great amps, from the starter to the high-end serie. It seems like you know Naturalness in Hifi...Cheers!