Aurender N20 Streamer & Holo May DAC vs Analog

Congradulations on the Aurender. It is a truly high end streamer. If you want to give your analog rig a better run for it’s money it will probably take a different DAC. The streamer is probably capable of getting really really close. . 

@ghdprentice 

Trial and error seems to be an expensive hobby.

Juan @blisshifi  texted the same suggestion.

@vonhelmholtz 

I just looked at your system and it’s well balanced as far as your choice of components. Before you go chasing another DAC, let’s look at optimizing your digital setup. I used to own separates including the N20, expect my PM shortly. 
 

In my case, my digital chain and analog chain cost me almost the same. Knowing your analog chain and having owned many similar pieces (VPI table and tonearm, MSL cartridge, Audionet phono), it is all very high quality and capable of exceptional reproduction. In my experience, the Holo, while coveted by many in the community, has a very different character - one that I find to side on the more articulate vs the musical and soulful. I tend to categorize it alongside the Tambaqui and DCS Bartok, where many will say it is musical while being articulate, but when compared to other DAC manufacturers like T+A, MSB, Gryphon, EMM, one can hear where the latter brands just have more tonal density, texture, air, and breath and the former brands sound more brittle and dry in comparison.

Circling back around, it required me to equal the investment I have in my analog rig to get my digital rig to perform about as well. While you can get much farther with digital with less when you are just starting out, once you’re in the endgame stage, digital becomes equally expensive to achieve similar endgame results that analog can offer.

@vonhelmholtz One other thing I recall is that you were just resent a new Holo after your last one failed. From what I read in the past, the Holo May requires up to 600 hours of play time to fully burn in. Where do you think you are with the unit timewise?

@blisshifi 

At 100 hours.  Agree, too soon.  Also, pretty sure USB and AES/EBU cables can be improved upon.  Lastly, have Shunyata Sigma and Alpha NR cables on other components, but Delta on Aurender.  Shunyata just had a huge price increase on their cables.

That much burn in you could die before hearing any music.

Can't really be true but, if you believe it........

Go analogue.

Posts like these make me feel great about what I am able to achieve with my well constructed but reasonably priced streamer setup vs. my much more expensive analog one. Both have slightly different presentation but are 100% equally satisfying. Details under my house of stereo system. Actually listening to my CD setup now, just as good too. Enjoy whatever you got!

To get the best out of the N20 you will need:

1. Get a 10mHz 75 Ohm clock, something like After Dark or Chinese will work, no need to spend $1000s, but a quality 75 Ohm clock cable is essential.

2. Hi-End power cable, $3-5k. For DAC too.

3.Silver USB cable 1.5m

4.Purple Fuse. For DAC too.

Concentrate on SSD playback until you get it sounding right before you start messing with streaming. No need to upsample. Switch DOP off if you have DSD files.

If you are considering changing your DAC the Terminator 12th Anniversary has a built-in clock output designed for the W20SE but it should work with the N20.

Check with Alvin at Denafrips.

Why not try swapping the higher-quality analog cables into your digital rig and vice versa just to see how much of the difference your hearing could be due to power cords and interconnects?  Might be interesting to know.  FWIW. 

@soix

Yes, good plan. but I will first upgrade USB since that is what is working best at this point.

@lordmelton

Is there an advantage to an external clock when the Aurender already has a quality clock and the May hasn’t any clock input? Is Silver critical with USB?

@baylinor

Sounds good to me.

@vonhelmholtz 

I went with the Curious USB cable. Used to have DH Labs silversonic. The Curious is more analog sounding, takes the sharp edge off what the Silversonic had. 

+1 for SOIX suggestion

100 hours is way too early on the May DAC, I wouldn’t start critical listening until at least 300, many recommendations are for 500….I have heard the Holo Audio May DAC KTE create magic in mine and other systems, but not at your equipment level

@vonhelmholtz 

Is there an advantage to an external clock when the Aurender already has a quality clock and the May hasn’t any clock input? Is Silver critical with USB?

A 10 mHz external clock helps the internal clock be more accurate. It makes a big difference. It is not essential to have a clock input/output on your DAC but the Terminator Anniversary kills two birds with one stone.

Silver USB works very well for me but USB cables seem to vary wildly in performance to cost.

As @soix said put your best analogue cables on your digital rig and compare.

However you need a few months for everything to burn in.

@lordmelton

I have the same analog cables from DAC to preamp and phono preamp to preamp, but I have higher quality power cables on all components, but only Audioquest Delta NR on Aurender.

The N20 is very sensitive to power cables. Use the best you have.

The Holo springs May KTE is a far better dac in absolute terms  but is not a streamer , the Aurender is nice ,they are known much more for their  streaming 

many guys buy a high end dac, then get a good streamer  the dac by far is the most important part of the system ,for all music starts there ,Good or bad , 

the speakers too equally. Important  .i have over 40 years as a Audiophile and. Owned a Audio store  Spending on a top quality dac the New Denafrips Terminator + 12 th anniversary is a bit better still .

@lordmelton 

I am within my 60 days at Music Direct, so will return Delta NR power cable.  I’ll look for used Sigma v2 NR cable. 

What do you hear with the Aurender that you don't hear with a BlueSound Node 2i?  If you can hear a significant difference, what would I hear that is different?  I might consider upgrading if there is a significant difference in sound quality.  Would I benefit more if I added a DAC to my BlueSound?   

Would it be blasphemy to say that if you de-couple the streamer's true purpose of delivering a file un-altered to the DAC on the back end that the front end is what matters?  For my money ROON does the front-end the best.

Now if you can find a streamer with a ROON core, do a blind test where the only thing you change is the streamer, your expensive Aurender streamer or any PC with a ROON client installed, can you actually tell the difference?

Theoretically if the streamer is not altering the file's contents the answer should be obvious.

So, what do your ears tell you (no cheating on the blind testing)?

In the final analysis the source file is what matters the most of all.  Try some 384 Khz 32 Bit Floating Point (see DXD specification for details) files out to see what they sound like.  On every single system they will improve the sound; better sonics make better sound not streamers.

Cheers

“if you can find a streamer with a ROON core”

There lies your rub @recherche ….so many variables with finding a one box ROON solution without the complexities of a science project or paying top dollars.

Streamers from Aurender, Innuos, Lumin and Auralic offers elegant one box solution….those who says they can do it cheaper and make it sound as good as the offerings from aforementioned brands, more power to them. I am not going to get in the way of their double, triple blind test escapades :-)

It’s worth to develop and upgrade both sources. I have to admit that some albums  are sounds much, much better from analog branch of my system, however some other albums are amazingly better from two of my digital branches. Depends on lots of factors. 

#1 Audioman

I agree, if it were within my finances, I’d love to have the 12th anniversary Denafrips Terminator Plus II…..but $7,250 is out of my range by quite a bit