A Top DAC

Take a look at this thread >

https://forum.audiogon.com/discussions/higher-end-dacs

@mikelavigne and @thyname have current MSB DACs

Interesting coincidence—I was looking more or less into the same thing, just after the holidays. I auditioned the reported "cream" of DAC-dom, listening to large orchestral & opera, blues, & rock.

Conclusions: at your level, you are looking at the following,

---------TOP tier

• Ideon Absolute DAC (if possible, get their full "absolute" set, with the re-clocker (absolute Time) & absolute Streamer— if not, don’t skimp on the "Time")
• MSB Select (if you can go that high, if not the cheaper two-box model—but IMO the difference ain’t subtle)* DCS Vivaldi (dac alone)

-------- Outstanding, but not in the same league (IMO, etc):

• Berkley Alpha reference
• Totaldac* Lampi Pacific
• MSB Ref

Of these, the Ideon Absolute digital front end combo was by far the most musically cogent, both using their own server & an "Extreme" (by SGM). It was like re-living the experience years ago, listening to A Parsons "Fall of the House of Usher" on a Goldmund Reference TT with a Goldfinger cartridge played thru an FM Acoustics phono...

On its own (i.e. without the "Time") the Absolute seemed to put forth the highest level of dynamic energy-visceral impact of the lot while retaining the refinement and detail at both frequency extremes. The Select retained the detail & the refinement offering a more laid-back presentation.

Both of these repeatedly sounded in a league of their own, suddenly making me forget the digital medium altogether. If anything, certain hi-res files sounded pleasingly analogue with more dynamic impact, low-end energy & high-end detail (note: from both new and OLD master-tapes!!!)

By comparison, the Vivaldi sounded a tad less refined (i.e. there was a suspicion of harshness & maybe somewhat less detail...). Note: I never auditioned their full combo, hence the inclusion in the "TOP" list.

I am not challenging the outstanding quality of many other devices out there-just reporting my experience.

EMM Labs DA2 V2 is a must audition if you are serious about scouting current crop of top tier DAC’s.

I also like OP top 3 choices...MSB Premier DAC, DCS Rossini, Pacific DAC

https://darko.audio/the-darko-dac-index/

Good list but as Darko says, the list is according to a subjective value quotientand not just their absolute sonic performance.

Darko gives Bartok an ‘uber’ rating. Can’t imagine not trying it. I guess in some groups it’s even a ‘budget’ unit. 

Just wondering since you have a very high end MSB Dac already do they offer any sort of upgrade path or trade-in? Might be a good way to go since you already know you like the sound of their Dacs.

They don’t offer any trade-up program, but I’m confident that I can sell the Analog DAC.  As you mentioned it is a really good DAC.  Question is, are today’s DACs that much better?

Depending on your M-T-Burn sensitivity rating, the Denafrips Terminator makes the most sense at 4k. That way in 2 years when there are 20 others even better available for less you won't feel like a complete idiot.

Don’t have much experience but am amazed by my Schitt Yggdrasil!

Chord Dave with Chord Mscaler

I have been told that the Chord is very good; hopefully I will be able hear it at Axpona this year.

Chord dacs are good better with headphones than speakers to my ears. I sold my TT2 to upgrade to the dCS Bartok. I couldnt be more pleased. We tested this against my friends dave with the mscaler and preferred the Bartok on speakers on headphones it depends on what you own. Then we tested his MSB Premire that was fully upgraded. The MSB is incredible as well. The Bartok falls somewhere between the chord and MSB to my ears. 

RME ADI-2 not on Darko's list? Listening to it right now, and I am not even interested in listening to others. Time to listen to music :-)

The Lampizator Pacific is Exceptional in the way it presents music 
with dynamics,detail, and you ar3 there realism , and has the ability to be tuned to different brands to tubes to suit your system 
and having a tube rectified power supply adds it’s soundstage width and depth . Is something solid state just can’t match .

Lindermann is unreal DAC, Musicbook Source.

Check out the Thrax Audio DAC, it may be one of the best DAC's ever designed.  http://audio-union.com/audio-union/thrax-audio/maximinus/

Here are two top tier DACs I don't see mentioned above:
1. For $38,000:  http://www.theabsolutesound.com/articles/theory-application-elektroakustik-sdv-3100-hv-dacpreamplifier-and-pdt-3100-hv-cdsacd-transport/

2. For $65,000: https://www.nagraaudio.com/nagra-hd-dac-x/

Now we're getting somewhere. : )

Nice to see the nod to Thrax. 

Also consider:

- CEC DA O 3.0 which implements Thrax and MSB parts, etc.
- Aries Cerat.
- TotalDAC
- Metronome

Have you compared any of these DACs?  Got a favorite?

For 16/44 24/96 Redbook and DXD PCM the MSB Select,  MSB Premier.
BTW the  MSB Analog DAC is still a good dac
Cheers George  

The Gryphon cdp- dac is also exceptional state of the art digital for only $35k .

On Darkos list ,they left out all the major True hi end dacs over $10 k
its not all about $$ but when you have no restrictions on build it opens the door 
to perfect the design. Having owned a Audio store I learned rule of thumb on average roughly only 25% of the cost goes into the build ,the rest overhead profit
and markup. This is for electronics and Loudspeakers, cables can be the largest profitmarkup up to 10x the actual cost in some cases.the builder decides on Everything  how much per hr $$ their R&D time should be worth!!

throwing in my rec here as i recently went through a dac serach. for me and my system, i found the rockna wavedream signature to be very nice and then when paired with the rockna wavedream net it really just went to a new level. i'm done looking at digital front ends (i'm 100% digital btw). 

please dm me if you have further questions but here's a quick description of what i'm hearing: i'm getting vinyl like tone and texture with a beautifully large soundstage. detail wise, i would say this is up there with any dcs or msb but i run mine on the hybrid filter which is more reminscent of the msb sound. the designer used to use and design msb modules but now he is creating them in house. it doesn't have the beautiful chassis of a dcs or msb but thats where you save some money too. i couldn't be happier with my purchase. (it feeds a soulution 721 pre which goes into a symphonic line kraft 300 that power s5 mk2's)

The new Bakoon Dac coming later this year will be worth waiting for imo.

CH Precision C1.1 with T1 and X1 power supply. You can also go for the mono version of the above set. Best I've ever heard. (admit that I have not heard all of the others)

Stickman451

I have not had a chance to compare any of these to any of the other ones on your list so I can only comment on what I’ve heard. Based on everything you read my vote would go to the DCS. A good friend of mine owns a high end audio store in the Chicago area and he is a DCS dealer and has been so for the last 3 years. His top digital brands used to be Esoteric, Berkeley & Playback Design, All well respected brands. When he got the DCS on the floor and customers started comparing this dac against that dac it was not even close. In the first year alone, he sold three times as many DCS dacs then all 3 of the other brands combined. 

I visit sit there frequently so I get a chance to listen to both the Bartok and the Rossini on many different types of electronics and speakers and the DCS stuff just sounds so good. They are very reliable as well. He has been in business for over 40 years and he claims that the DCS gear is the best digital he’s ever heard. I agree. If you want a streamer/dac I think the DCS is going to be tough to beat. Good luck with whatever you choose.

Scot

I’m going to get an in-house demo of the DCS Rossini and the external clock this weekend.  It’ll be an interesting comparison to my Analog DAC.  Will post my impressions early next week.

This thread feels like a bunch of people arguing over the right shade of white. You can pretty much guarantee that whatever is hooked up to this level of DAC is going to have a far greater impact on the sound ... far far greater, than the DAC itself, so unless you are demoing it in your system, it is at best a crap shoot.

@stickman451 

What did you end up purchasing and why?
Have you been happy with your purchase?

Thanks... 👍

@stickman451,

How did you like DCS Rossini with external clock?