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Pioneer Direct Drives - Now and then?

I'm toying with the idea of getting into vinyl in the near future, and saw a recent model Pioneer recommended as a poor-man's Technics.  Also saw some very pretty vintage units for sale here and there.

I'm wondering if anyone has direct experience with them who could offer suggestions?
erik_squires
chakster's avatar
chakster
6,144 posts
 
In what way is it better?

@glupson, did you ever compare Pioneer and Technics?

I did that and i will tell you while the old SL1210mkII and Pioneer PLX-1000 can be compared and this is where the Pioneer can be slightly better, because an old SL1210 mkII had some weak parts (which can be easily upgraded by the user himself).

The mk7 is a brand new turntable with new CORELESS MOTOR, new tonearm, new footers, new cabinet, it’s entirely different, no weak parts like in old SL1210mkII from 20th century. It is also much better design.

The mk7 is simplified version of the SL1200GR and reference SL1200G. It has nothing to do with an old SL1210 mkII, except the same dust cover.

Pioneer is competitive only with old Technics from SL1200mkII to SL1200 mk6 (and everything in between).

But Technics mk7 is the answer to Pioneer and all the clones you can find in every store like, click here and try to ID where is the Technics between all those Technics clones from many other manufacturers.

If you like Pioneer you should start with PL-70II - this is an original High-End turntable made by Pioneer in the 70s.

Could you tell me why the Pioneer released a "clone" of Technics instead their own great original design ?

Denon, for example, never tried to copy Technics look when they made something for audiophiles (not for clubs/djs like Pioneer), this is Denon 100th Anniversary turntable (specs are here) and here is another Denon for DJs. Both are entirely different.

If Pioneer could make a re-issue of their classic Exclussive series i’d love to buy one (but the price could be insane).

At the moment only Technics can do that, because the SP10R pretended to be superior to the SP10 mkIII. And still reasonably priced! 





glupson
7,842 posts
 

chakster,


I got the part about new Technics having more sophisticated parts than Pioneer and that is what I assumed just based on price differences. I was wondering if there is any significant performance difference.


Of course, I have no knowledge about Pioneer business decisions involved in marketing this PLX-1000, but I have my guess.


That particular (1200ish) design has been copied by many over the years. I would guess that some manufacturer had one in the works or already ready and Pioneer took it and branded it as Pioneer. That way they had an opportunity to put it on the market quickly and capitalize on growing turntable market without wasting time and resources on development of the whole new product and manufacturing side.


Technics seems to have been attempting to resurrect the whole brand (not only turntable part) with turntables being the most visible ambassador product. Pioneer just needed some turntable to add to the existing product line.


Could you tell me why Technics released a "clone" of their own great original design instead of making a new own great original design? I am simply not a fan of 1200 (and its clones including Pioneer) design. Why wouldn't they release a nice turntable that does not look like their designer got fired on the day the project development started. 1500C is much better attempt at design, but lacking in final execution.

billwojo
397 posts
 

helomech said
"It's a good performer in the objective sense, however, it does play with the forced-weightiness and digital-like glare typical of DD tables"What in the world is "digital-like glare typical of DD tables"? I also have no clue what "forced-weightiness" refers to.
If your going to make a statement like that than back it up please.

BillWojo
elliottbnewcombjr
7,796 posts
 
or, for a grand finish, start with something like this dual arm plinth, (convert CAD, the dollar is strong now) (this one is sold)

https://www.canuckaudiomart.com/details/649402362-victor-jvc-clp2d-rosewood-plinth-for-tt71-tt81-tt101-direct-drive-turntablerare/

add a JVC Direct Drive Spinner, i.e. TT61, 71, 81

start with a stereo arm in the rear. add a long stereo arm on the side. then change the rear cartridge to mono, bingo you end up with a teeeerific TT system.
chakster's avatar
chakster
6,144 posts
 
Could you tell me why Technics released a "clone" of their own great original design instead of making a new own great original design? I am simply not a fan of 1200 (and its clones including Pioneer) design. Why wouldn’t they release a nice turntable that does not look like their designer got fired on the day the project development started. 1500C is much better attempt at design, but lacking in final execution.

We discussed this issue here when they released new line of turntables.
When SL1200GAE was out no one could imagine Technics will make cheaper G, GR, mk7 and 1500 series soon. And no one can imagine SP10R as the reference deck from Technics.

The answer is very simple:
Technics just made a newer version of their iconic SL1200mkII+ series, simply because it was the most popular turntable in the world (they sold millions of them like no other brand in the history). The reason why SL1200 mkII - mk6 were so popular is obvious - only because of the the club culture, SL1200mkII became reference DJ turntable since the early 80’s worldwide, it is an industry standard for professionals (clubs or radiostations).

But it was originally made as a Hi-Fi component. This model almost immediately replaced belt-drive Thorens turntables used by the first disco deejays in the 70’s (at studio 54 and in many placed in NYC). Technics appeared to be ideal for DJing, it was robust, made like a tank with powerful Direct Drive motor. And Technics made a pitch control +/- 8% as a fader (not a knob). It was groundbreaking turntable for night club industry and dj culture (and still is).

So why do you think Technics should have to ignore their iconic model when their own master plan was to make SP-10R a bit later anyway? They just updated everything, released different turntables for different categories of people (including deejays and audiophiles).

For the most critical listeners they made SP-10R and SL1200GAE





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