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Would love some feedback / Denon DL-S1 / phono match / cart recomendations

Would love some feedback / Denon DL-S1 / phono match / cart recomendations

- Vinyl newbie and need some help

- Friend has a brand new  Denon DL-S1 for $600 - good deal?

- I have a Mark Levinson No.326s preamp and just bought the dual mono MM/MC Phono module boards. They are the identical boards from the No,32 preamp and read that was a very nice sounding phono preamp.

- No.326s only has a couple settings 42db or 60 db and 47k ohm or 200 ohm load

- I picked up a used Bob's Device 1131 thinking it would help as my No.326s has limited setting options and read the 1131 might not work well with this cart. That this cart is tough to get the most out of but can be great.

- Should I get another cart? Was it a mistake getting the 1131 SUT. I read the No.326s sounded nice with this SUT so went for it but don't know enough to really know better either way but trying to learn.

- The No.326s phono boards has these little gold terminal screws with easy tighten by hand little knobs on the heads of the screws to add either capacitor or resistor to make the phono very adjustable but would have no idea how to figure out how to use that but thought to mention

- just wondering if this is a bad cart for me to try with my phono and SUT set up and any feedback about anything related to a cart would be super appreciated if anyone reads this. Thanks

more info if helpful below but not need to answer my question just thought to add it :)

______________________________________________________________________________________


I just finished up a full system re-fit with some tweaking here and there still to do but I am extremely happy with the sound I’m getting today from my new to me system. I sold my entire old system that was tubes and high efficiency speakers and got new to me: speakers, amp, preamp, speaker cables and upgraded digital transport and got a new turntable. Kept my DAC never changing that. Love my DAC. 

This system is the best I’ve personally ever had. I’m pretty psyched - so psyched I just added a turntable. 

A modern Version of the VPI Prime Aries with HRX Feet, 10" 3D Arm and Base, Prime Signature Platter, Ring and Motor. 

I am looking for a cart and my friend has a new Denon DL-S1 for $600 he also has a  used but good shape Clearaudio Accurate mc cart for a few hundred but i never heard of this one and a  van den Hul blackheart grass hopper which I know nothing of.

I thought because the Denon is new never used that was the best option but any of you know anything about the other let me know please.
  
Would love some feedback / ideas / thought recommendations and help. I’m a digital guy and want to give vinyl and honest to goodness try.

As stated above I just purchased the dual mono Phono board modules for my
Mark Levinson No.326s linestage so it’s now a full function Preamp and added a Bobs Device 1131 SUT and both were attained a very reasonable cost which was great!

Just not sure if these carts will go with my phono and SUT.

Rest of my System:
https://systems.audiogon.com/systems/5160

- Magico S5 Loudspeakers
- Pass Labs X350.5 Amplifier
- Mark Levinson No.326s Preamp/phonostage
- Bricasti M1 Special Edition DAC
- PS Audio P10 Power Plant
- Kubala-Sosna Emotion SC’s
- Nordost/Cardas IC’s
- Assorted PC's Verastarr/Cardas

- Digital PC based front end that I have been tweaking and evolving:
- Sonore microRendu 1.4
- Full Suite of UpTone Audio Gear
(2) x LPS-1 Ultra Capacitor PS
JS-2 Linear Power Supply
(2) Regens - ISO/Amber
- (8) Canare / Oyide DC cables
- (2) Breeze Audio 12v LPS
- Tellurium Q Black Diamond Reference USB cable
- Curious Regen Link USB Cable.

This Digital Front End beat out: Lumin, Antipodes, Naim and Auralic servers. It needs everything to work so well but man does it work great. My hope is that a turntable can complete and wish some luck I end up liking it better. That’s why I’m asking for help. I want to put my best vinyl foot forward 

** Back Ground info**

** Room is **
14 x 24 w/Cathedral Ceilings - 16 Foot a peak

** Music likes **
Assorted Music but no metal or loud hard rock anymore really - not much Large Scale classical either but everything else. I listen just loud enough to sound its best but not a loud listener. I enjoy normal levels.

** Likes / Priorities **
Transparency - Delicacy - Linear - High resolution - microscope but not sterile not etched or lifeless -some natural warmth and life to the music is key  but love that see through transparency and love precise soundstage - remove as many layers without being clinical - tight bass - hate flab - but don’t need worlds greatest slam but love speed and accurate bass while being musical.

** Perspective **
I’m only a couple months into this new system and I was struggling to get the right Preamp and tried a half dozen or so searching for the right balance and the one that could bring my new system together like only the perfect matching preamp can do. Each system is different so really it must be heard to know it’s what you want. I believe in the Preamp and knew If I could find the right match it would change everything. Well that was the hope.

To make a long story longer the Mark Levinson No.326s preamp did this and more. I was hedging my expectations based on the disappointments of the others I tried and failed but the No. 326s nailed it and honestly it an incredible Preamp and then some. I was so happy I decided to upgrade and add the built in phonostage option and SUT and Turntable here we are trying to chose a cart.

Really appreciate any help you can provide! I know this is kind of long but wanted you guys to know where I’m coming from! If you would like more info please let me know - all comments and feedback are most welcome and deeply appreciated :)




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rauliruegas
12,786 posts
 
Dear @fsmithjack : You really was in a hurry but now I understand that you have no worries but I can give you an example of what you losted with almost the same money because that " hurry ":

720.00 for the SUT plus 600 for the S1 = 1,320.00 ( btw, if the seller of the up-dated 326S was the same of the SUT then he was ignorant, stupid or only want to take your money. I hope the seller were diferent and with out knew you own the 326S. ).

Well this Ortofon A90 ( was designed to celebrate the Ortofon 90 anniversary. ) even with 400 hundred hours on ( still with at least other 400 hundred hours on it. ) is way way over better quality performer ( if quality level is important to you. ) vs not only the S! but aginst all the other cartridges posted here. The A90 is today still one of the best cartridge ever:

https://www.audiogon.com/listings/cartridges-ortofon-mc-a90-phono-cartridge-2017-12-06-analog


"""   get a better phono cable and base for under my table . """, yes this will be a very good move.


@rantzmar , the OP Levinson has 78dbs that’s more than enough.

Regards and enjoy the MUSIC NOT DISTORTIONS,
R.
anotherjblnut's avatar
anotherjblnut
19 posts
 
I too was offered a great deal on a nearly new DL-S1 several years ago. It was used on a VPI Classic. I did not have enough gain in my pre at the time (ProJect Tube Box II SE) but I was able to secure a Bob's Cinemag SUT. I just could not get the sound I wanted (was somewhat lean and treble focused but brilliant on some recordings). So I then researched better phono stages and stepped up to a Pass Xono. But after countless hours playing with loading I still was never fully happy with it.

I now have an Audio Technica ART9 and my search is over. Read the huge thread here on it....
dgarretson
2,588 posts
 
For a time just prior to the product’s discontinuation, the street price for a new DL-S1 was around $500. I purchased one from Comet Supply at that price. Performance is not far off an ART7 (a bit threadbare as you suggest) but with clarity and dynamic swing at +68db-76db gain through AQVOX or Pass X-25 phono stages. At +68db with the AQVOX there was a bit of background noise. I can’t imagine that the Levinson’s +60db gain will be anything close to noiseless, but should be sufficient for the purpose of a casual comparison to Levinson with Cinemag. In any case, it’s a worthy introduction to vinyl. I think there are lots of better used turntable and arm choices than the VPI for around $3K, but it is certainly an audiophile-vetted product with a high ease-of-use quotient and predictable resale value, should the OP desire to move up.
fsmithjack's avatar
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fsmithjack OP
712 posts
 
I came close. There is a Gerrard 301 Full rehab in here for $4500 with a Dynavector 20x2 Cart but I went for the VPI. It’s funny but I tried for a while and looked and if had someone to give me some good ideas I would have tried another table. I didn’t want a Rega or Music Hall or Project or any of the older Technics or Thorens or Denons. I wanted something kind of modern and not super hard to use and If I am not crazy about It I can get my money back. A decent starter table well it’s a bit better than that but that’s what it is. There was an Aritisan Fidelity Lenco L75 with a nice Origin Live arm but was out of my range. There was an AmaZon Reference with DP-6 Morch 12” arm but I needed to have some acrylic company out of the country make me a custom board and then drill holes and I’m too much a newbie for all that but that was close. It’s funny because I was a tube guy for years and bought tons from Kevin - his tubes are awesome even if he is joe salesman. I saw those VPI tables Kevin had for $7,000 and loved them and wanted one. Was looking for weeks and one popped up and bam I hit it like pigeons on popcorn! I also have met Harry and think he’s a super nice guy and there is good demand for their tables. Sure there is better there always is but would have been open to better table and still am if you guys have any advice. I flip gear often and am not afraid to play around with something and ship it right the heck out if I am not enamered with it. No worries. The only thing before my Magico’s that I was attached to was my Bricasti. That thing is never going anywhere except back to Brian ever 6 Months for the latest hard add upgrade. Rather than releasing new products he just keeps upgrading the old one and that keeps his sales brisk and he loyal owners super happy. What tables are better for $3,000 - I love to learn new stuff. Thanks 
nandric's avatar
nandric
4,086 posts
 

I like assumptions to be made explicit such that we can see

on what grounds the conclusions are made.

My assumptions regarding SUT are :

1. The inductance  and impedance of both need to

     correspond.

2. The SUT's are divided in 3 ''categories'': L,M and H.

    There is no exact or precise  information about the

    ''impedance range'' of each. Say 2-8 Ohms for Low;

     8- 15 (?) for M and above 15 for H.

      Because the usual approach is to search for the

     'right SUT'' for our specific MC cart this ''impedance

      matching'' is a kind of ''hit and miss'' affair .

3.   What about inductance? I have no idea about inductance

      of  any of my + 30 MC carts. How then should I search

      for the ''corresponding inductance''?

 Assuming that designers by Denon know the theory they

  have designed  DL-S1 to correspond with AU-S1 SUT.

So probably one will get a ''killer combo'' for about $2000.

With an decent MM phono-pre one does not need to buy

ridiculous expensive MC phono-pre as added advantage.

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