Trans-Fi Terminator Tonearm: 2019 Update
Hi Terry, where are you putting the pressure gauge ? 0.5psi right before air enters the manifold? It seems a gauge is really required for me now. I’ll look into you recommendation. Regarding long run of horse acting as surge tank. I spoke to a friend and he seem to think that the ideal situation is to use stiffer tubing material than plastic, more like copper, and coiling the copper tube radiator style. Not sure if purely running long plastic tubes would create an effective surge tank ? @spiritofmusicI tried Vic’s air pressure test, and I am fine for now. There doesn’t seem to be air pressure coming from the manifold at my present level. Though with a gauge I will be able to give a more precise. |
At the output of the surge tank, before the plastic hose. That's half inch hose, pretty thick stuff. Anyway, don't see why rigid is better - it seems to me that rigid would accurately send all the pulse information directly to the tonearm - when that information is exactly what we are trying to smother - it is smoothing that is needed. |
Concerning pressure gauges and valves. My Terminator rig is in storage, but I recall that optimal results were obtained with a Weiss pressure gauge in combination with a high quality brass needle valve. You need simple brass automotive fittings and nipples to make the connections. A good brass needle valve is less turbulent than a plastic aquarium valve. To obtain the most accurate display of operating pressure at the tonearm manifold, place the valve between the gauge and the manifold. With the valve closed, the gauge displays maximum pressure available from the pump. As the valve is opened, the gauge displays a drop in pressure from the pump that is equal to the pressure at the manifold. Try it, you’ll like it. |
@dgarretson Thanks for the Fabco info. I was a bit lost as to what to look for. Correct me if I’m wrong. It looks like a three-way valve. The turn knob is opposite to a open valve where a future Weiss gauge could be inserted, and the tubing passes through the other two holes. Given the addition of surge tanks, and a clear difference in pressure input, at the pump end, and output, at the manifold, I am inclined to place the gauge before the manifold as you have done. This way one reads the actual pressure going directly into the arm. One last question regarding the gauge. Most of the Weiss gauge I’ve been able to find has a calibration from 0-10 PSI. As the arm is seeing pressure in the low single digits, is there a specific model gauge that you were using? @terry9 is setting his arm at 0.5 PSI at the pump end. @terry9 The stiffness of material was mentioned in the context of a different surge tank. Instead of using plastic barrels or PVC tubes, my friend suggested using coiled copper tubing, like radiators, as another form of air modulator. For this type of ‘surge tank’ to be effective, the tubing material has to be stiff, at least stiffer than the plastic tubing that air is traveling in. The only question in my mind is whether simply using long runs of plastic / silicone, i.e. soft, tubing modulates air flow. It doesn’t seem to disrupt or otherwise ‘ modulates’ the behavior of the air flow. In anycase, my total length of tubing used is probably 5 m, so l cannot test the benefits of long tube runs. It’s purely speculation on my part. |
I’d like to start a different line of inquiry into the Trans Fi arm ——cartridge compatibility. For a few months now, I have been researching my next cartridge purchase. Right now a ZYX Ulitmate 100 is in service. And with all the help and input from y’ all, the arm - cartridge - phono stage is very well optimized for a entry level set up. The typical arm mass vs cartridge compliance criteria does not readily apply to a linear tracker. What do you look to in determining which cartridge will work with the Terminator? What are the best cartridges that have graced the arm? And more importantly, what have not worked so well? I’d appreciate any input. |
I’ve been using DS Audio optical cartridges successfully for over a year now on the Terminator. They are lightweight and pair very well with Andrey’s carbon arm wand. In the past I used an Ortofon A-93 successfully. A superheavy Dynavector XV-1S didn’t work so well.
Lately I’ve also been using the Audio Machina V8 (https://audiomachina.com/v8/) , an anti-vibrational pad slotted between the headshell and the wand. This definitely helped: better focus, greater dynamics, lower noice, greater weight to the sound. |
Andrey's email : [email protected] website : https://www.musicfromvinyl.shop/ Be warned: shipment from Moscow could take up to 1.5 month or longer. XLR cables I ordered from Andrey took 3 months to get to East Asia. Pay extra and have him ship Fedex. |
What do you need to know? It's an improvement in every way. Critically lower mids/upper bass articulation, imaging and air. I was hugely skeptical...I mean, it's pretty much the same design except for the mix of brass and aluminium in the manifold/slider, rather than 100% aluminium, carbon fibre armwand, and smaller, more precisely engineered air holes in the manifold. No way could this sound more than marginally better, if at all better full stop, was my sentiment. I was absolutely dumbfounded upon install. All of original Terminator's strengths were there, with these added benefits, resulting in a wholly superior listening experience, adding way more delicacy and sophistication to the sound, making jazz and classical altogether more timbrally accurate and effortless. |
@sgunther There are plenty of testimonies from long time Terminator adopters here, especially the early threads. @spiritofmusic gives a succinct reply. I came to the fully updated Terminator from a SME V arm. And the improvements in vinyl playback are across the board. @simes and @spiritofmusic , thank you for the cartridge selection inputs. My apologies for the late reply. My amp malfunctioned, and I am now in limbo land. It seems that cartridge weights of + 15 g would be workable. I am also using a trans-impedance phono amp, so low impedance becomes an additional requirement for my search. And I am looking into the Audio Machina V8. I do have a question regarding setting VTF. The carbon fiber wand comes with brass discs as counter-weights. However, they require very delicate maneuvering, and I cannot repeat my setting with any consistency. How do you go about setting VTF with the Terminator? How do you get repeatable results? What special tools are involved? |
@sgunther What is the size of your tank? I have changed from a Rena 250 ( ? ) pump to a more powerful Enhiem 400 due to surge tanks mods. 20 liter and 25 liter tanks filled with cotton / paper balls are placed in sequence to a 5 liter empty tank. With this setup, the initial Rena pump had no problems running the Terminator with slight increase in output. However, inserting a 40cm long, 3” pvc pipe capped at both ends as a smoothing tank severely limited the output of the Rena pump, hence the switch to the Enhiem pump. |
A question on setting VTF : In a recent adjustment to the wire harness, I decided to pull it closer to the cartridge. The wire harness rests on the front face of the slider. Small adjustment to the harness is necessary as we play records. The problem I am encountering is setting VTF in this configuration. The slightest tuck on the harness will yield a different reading on the VTF gauge. Measuring VTF at different positions on the platter will yield different readings as well. This presumably is caused by the harness acting on the wand, and thereby changing the weight of the wand + cartridge. The changes in VTF reading can vary from 0.1g to 0.4 g!! And that is a serious problem. I then pulled the harness to the back which is the more typical position. And even in this position a slight tuck on the harness chances the VTF. Now the variations is in the 0.05 g range. But it is still changing. I always understood that the harness was acting on the wand, and then the effect is negligible. However, given these measurements, my questions are : As the wand travels across the platter, it seems that the VTF is constantly changing? Is that right? Am I doing something wrong? |
No, you're unfortunately right. It's my biggest bugbear with the arm. I pretty much check VTF on a daily basis, normally have to adjust at least every other day. I'm about to install super-fine Zavfino Litz-76 tomearm wire which should minimise this tendency. But I've yet to find a foolproof way to dress the cable to fully prevent VTF going out of whack regularly. |
I Iearn not to be too fussy. Middle of the lp does for me. On average, I need to adjust 2x per week, occasionally 3x. Just something I've got used to. But fully concur for some/many this would be a deal breaker. I'm optimistic that the super-fine Zavfino tonearm wire I'm soon getting installed will minimise wire drag to such an extent that this issue gets minimised or even eliminated. |
Please post results once Zavfino wires are in place. I would be extremely curious! I am also having a silver tonearm wire custom made. The wire I ordered is from Aural Harmony. Twisted configuration is how it will be implemented and paired with a battery charged current mode phono preamp. However, the new wires, once completed, may still cause problems. :( The effect of wire drag on VTF is quite a revelation for me. On the one hand, the arm is tracking with constantly varying VTFs'. On the face of it this should be a disaster. The effect of the stylus on the record must not be good. On the other hand, the listening experience is anything but unpleasant. I guess I am saying I do no hear variable VTF at play, or I do not know how to. This is not to excuse the design flaw. However, a simple solution to mitigate the drag effect has to exist...... |
The wires are threaded through one of the holes in the arm wand. They will invariably touch and assert a force on the wand. As the arm travels across the platter, the force on the wand varies, thus creating a constantly varying VTF. The differential on VTF, according to my measurements is 0.05 g - 0.08 g, between the edge and center of platter. The solution is to isolate the wires from the wand. Given the nature of the arm, this would be very difficult to achieve. Alternatively, one could use a very light collar to affix the wire to the wand. This should allow for a force of contact that is constant between the wire and the wand. Presumably, this should care of the variable VTF problem. This will of course increase the mass of the arm, but at least its a constant mass. |
The wires are threaded through one of the holes in the arm wand. They will invariably touch and assert a force on the wand. As the arm travels across the platter, the force on the wand varies, thus creating a constantly varying VTF. The differential on VTF, according to my measurements is 0.05 g - 0.08 g, between the edge and center of platter.With a caveat that I have never seen this arm in the flesh - I would have thought the solution surely is to pin the wire to the apex of the air bearing carrier ( L section aluminium on top ). This would mean the loading from the wire on tracking force would be consistant across the record. If you then run a loop from the apex of the carrier to the overhanging bracket, then the impact of the wire would then be on the lateral loading force on the cartridge/armtube/carrier and would be as a %age of the effective mass much lower ( arm has higher effective mass in the lateral plain ) and less impactful on the set up. By the way I note in the setup referred to earlier in this thread it looks like the gentleman has the wire connected to the overhanging bracket at the beginning of the record - obviously making sure the bracket as located in the CENTE of travel would minimise the overall effect. If you listen to classical you could experiment with biasing the position closer to the end of the record so that the difficult inner grooves are less affected. I prefer the captive air bearing/decoupled counterweight approach of the Eminent Technology ET2 which I have had for over 30 years. In my experience most aftermarket tonearm wires are too stiff for air bearing arms. I found the least impact on lateral forces to be vintage silk copper litz (plastic and teflon sleeves too stiff ) and of whats avaialble today the Audionote silver litz and Kondo Fairy wire being the most flexible and least impactful on tracking forces. |
@dover Thanks for your input. While noting your caveat for not having seen or use the arm in the flesh, your instinct for the wire harness to rest on the apex of 'L' shape carrier seems a good one. However, it is the travel of the wire after affixing to the top of the carrier that causes problems. It will invariably make unwanted contact with the arm wand down the road. I tried this configuration after reading your post. I believe the wire contact with the carrier also affects the air pressure applied to the arm. In this configuration, the discrepancies in VTF's between outer and inner platter is as high as 1.0g! The main problem is that the wires are not stiff enough to remain in a fixed position. And as the wires are loose, it will go off balance after a few spin of the records. However, stiffer wires are generally heavier. And they too will go off balance, creating greater havoc. Right now, the solution is split the wires into right - left sides and co-join them at the pivot point of the wand. |
@ledouxThanks for feedback - very interesting. The advantage of the ET2 here is that with the vertical pivot point outside the record due to the longer armtube, you can use a hanging loop to a fixed point behind the arm which does not affect VTF and is vertually negligible effect on lateral force if you use a light flexible wire and dress it properly. I think the captive bearing of the ET2 has a benefit here as well. You could do a custom longer armtube to get the pivot point outside the record - particularly if you use composite materials to keep the mass down. Then you could do a "hanging from the pivot" solution. The only other thought I had was to have a flagpole on the arm carrier centred on the apex, and then you could run the wire up the flag pole and have a hanging loop back to a fixed point. |
@dover Thanks for your thoughts. I am beginning to appreciate one of the virtues of the ET arm regarding wire management / VTF. Having tried a few applications that involve attachment to the carrier, I am of the opinion that the wire harness should not touch the carrier at all. The carrier is in direct contact with air pressure applied to the arm. Any attachment to the carrier affects its leveling and alters the air pressure asserted to the arm. Any application that touches the carrier in order to secure the wires, be it a plastic tag or a 'flagpole', creates wild discrepancies in the VTF between inner and outer platter. My guess is that the attachments on the carrier alters the air pressure in a far greater extent than the contacts of the wire harness on the wand. Hence I could not get consistent VTF readings even with the cartridge in the same location on the platter. A mere reset of the wand to make another measurement is enough to change the VTF! As mentioned above, splitting the wires into two and reconnect at the pivot point of the wand seem to create the least damage for now. |
I've had the transfi tonearm for over 5 years now. Used a Danner AP-8 (Sera/Top Fin). Out of the box it never had > 1.6 PSI all the way up at the pump. But the arm seemed OK around 1 PSI anyway. Only used a 1 liter tank near the pump. Decided to revisit all this, had a feeling the Danner was never really good enough, not that I needed more PSI, but seemed like it wasn't optimal. Reading posts about large and multiple smoothing tanks. But that many large tanks seemed like only something like the Hiblow pump could handle. So I tried a 6 gallon tank, using a Fluval Q2. Out of the box this had 4 PSI at the pump. But it could not push any air out of that size tank for some reason, no leaks either. So went to a 2 gallon, then to the 1 liter tank which is now ~ 3 feet from arm. The Fluval was able to push thru those OK, albeit it loses ~.4 PSI by the time it reaches the arm, which is fine. Must be the amount of back pressure these pumps can handle, the Danner seemed weak comparatively. As others reported, the extra smoothing tank and stronger pump made a very nice difference. I may do a Hiblow someday, and get the 6 gallon tank running. But for now, I wish I would have spent the extra $$$ sooner and did this right. |
"As others reported, the extra smoothing tank and stronger pump made a very nice difference. I may do a Hiblow someday, and get the 6 gallon tank running. But for now, I wish I would have spent the extra $$$ sooner and did this right " @dnicol Very happy that the added surge tank contributed to better SQ. I am a bit curious as to why your pump cannot work with the 6 gallon tank. For my application, there are four surge tanks / filter connected in series. The surge tanks ( plastic water containers ) are 4 + 20 + 25 litre, so approximately 10.8 gallon in total. The originally supplied Sera pump had no problem pushing through these. And the sound quality improved with the addition of each tank, so I am wondering why the 6-gallon tank won't work? I added a fourth filter consisting of a 3" PVC pipe, 40 cm in length capped at both ends. The addition of this PVC filter caused problems for the Sera, whereupon I switch to a Eheim 400 pump which is still in service. I would encourage the addition of extra surge tanks. I believe you will be able to hear increased improvement. |
"I am a bit curious as to why your pump cannot work with the 6 gallon tank." Let me clear that up a bit, the 6 gallon tank does eventually fill, but it takes 4-5 minutes for it to show max pressure at the outlet with a gauge. So I decided that it seemed to be too much back pressure on these little aquarium pumps. Moving to a pond pump would of course take care of that problem, but there's the overkill aspect as well. Currently a 2 gallon and a 1 liter tank fill much faster, and is likely much easier on the pump, and still provide plenty of reserve. Moving the smaller 1 liter tank very close to the table seemed to help as well. My take on the sonic effects, is while the smoothing seems beneficial, (vs pulsing, although the Fluval pump pulses much less than Danner types), I wonder if having all that reserve tank air is helping as well, not relying so much on the pump being consistent. The consistency comes from a full large tank itself. |
@dover Could you point me to a recommended transformer? Also, Here is an update on the wire harness / VTF front. I would spin one side of a record to allow the wire to settle. Then comes the VTF measurement with each listening session.There is usually a 0.03 g VTF variation between inner and outer groove. The biggest variable is temperature/ humidity. With a recent cold front coming through our region, adjustments had to be made. But otherwise, the VTF has been very stable. |
@ledoux1238 Re the isolation transformer. So i have to be careful because how the power is delivered varies by country. In new Zealand we have 230V and separate phase, neutral AND ground. An isloation transformer is simply a 1 to 1 transformer - 230v in and out. From wiki... These days most people use RCD's ( fast acting circuit breakers ). I did not use an audiphile device, just an old school large isolation trans as described. An electrician should be able to point you in the right direction for your country/environment. Great news on the VTF variation - 0.03g sounds pretty good. |
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@ledoux1238, Reading your posts about the VTF changing due to the wire. I use Cardas 34x4 "Clear" Tonearm Cable. Very very light and flexible. I haven't noticed VTF change due to the little wire holder clip on the manifold using this cable. The cable I got from Vic, the stiffer litz that you could literally spread out the strands and it would stay, now that sort of wire might cause some changes, or even other types, but the Cardas is literally almost like a wet noodle. |
It seems that finding the "optimal" PSI or pressure for the manifold is not that simple. Adjusting pressure down until it skips or mistracks, then adding pressure until it's gone, may not be exactly optimal, since adding even more pressure than this test calls for changes the sound and the soundstage, and even bass response, IME. Certainly if you hear air noise when setting stylus in a stationary groove would be too much pressure. You also can't throw out a number like .3 or 1 PSI, because the weight of the cartridge, mounting parts, brass weights on pivot points, aluminum or carbon wand, will change the amount of PSI needed. Adjusting by ear for now. How do others do this? |
@dover Thanks for the explanation on transformer. I'll consult a local electrician. It's 110v here. @dnicol Regarding wire harness, I am using a XLR set of wires sent from Andrey. Coming out of the cartridge, it is split into four feather thin wires, two per side of wand. They are co-joined at the pivot point. Would you mind sending me an photo of the way you dress your wire. al dot ho at hohou dot com.I really would like to see how it is done right. Regarding pressure on the arm, I am adjusting by ear.I have yet to install a pressure gauge. |
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Hi guys, This is my first post on Audiogon. I have ordered a new Terminator from Andrey and: A Hiblow HP 40 air pump https://practicalgardenponds.com/collections/hiblow-aeration/products/hiblow-hp-series-linear-air-pumps?variant=31251397443715 A Fairchild Low Pressure Regulator https://www.valinonline.com/products/11122nnkrsb An Ashcroft 0-3 psi gage. https://www.valinonline.com/products/251490a02b3- Thanks very much to ledoux1238, terry9, and spiritofmusic for advice on getting started. I have two Clearaudio TT2 tonearms which are SLT and have a similar very short wand like the Terminator. I am planning to use a Clearaudio tonearm cable with the Terminator. This will go directly from the cartridge to the phono amp.
I am writing today primarily about the many comments here on variable VTF with the Terminator. While much of this variation in VTF readings may be due to the supplied cable, there are other causes as well. (Especially) with the short tonearm, there is a horizontal force from the stylus to the gage due to the stylus “settling” on the gage and wanting to push the gage forward away from the arm. There are also horizontal forces created by out-of-level conditions or from the tonearm wires pushing or pulling on the tonearm wand.
I modified a Riverstone stylus pressure gage to achieve accurate readings with my current tonearms. https://www.amazon.com/Riverstone-Audio-Record-Level-Turntable-Resolution/dp/B076DFZDS4?ref_=ast_bbp_dp&th=1&psc=1 You can see pictures at https://systems.audiogon.com/systems/9362 (last two pics). I bought two gages and modified one to prove to myself that this corrects the problem. It does correct the problem and gives accurate and consistent reading with the Clearaudio arms. I expect that it will do the same with the Terminator.
In using the modified gage, you need to move the gage slightly after the cartridge settles to get the threads holding the pendulum to be vertical.
I hope that this is helpful for you in resolving VTF errors. Don |
Just finished my Panzerholz wand. It's more massive than the Tomahawk but that's for the (higher mass) Koetsu, so that I don't need to add weights and damping material all over the thing. I also use an aluminum disk (alloy 7075) tapped to mate with the threads from the cartridge screws in lieu of nuts and washers - tidier. It measures better than the Tomahawk and is rather more revealing. On good recordings that's good, on poor recordings it's not. So far. This morning I'll be playing around with resistive loading and may have a different story to tell. |
@redcars2, Don, thank you for finally posting your adventure here. I eagerly await your input on the Terminator. Over the weekend, a quick research was done on the Clearaudio TT2 arm(s), I believe, that you are using. It is a roller-bearing in a glass tube design, not air bearing. That’s a big difference, although the pump and surge tanks you’re about to buy should be a good start. The arm tube in the TT2 and the arm wand in the Terminator are also quite different. While both are made of carbon fiber, the wand is a flat perforated plate. It’s relationship to the tonearm wires is unlike that of the arm tube of the TT2. The wires are threaded through the arm tube in the TT2, if I am not mistaken, very much like a pivot arm arrangement. The wires are exposed, dangling, and not affixed to the wand in the Terminator. The contact of the wires on the wand therefore varies as the arm travels through an LP. This is the varying contact force that I was referring to in earlier posts, hence the varying VTF. I think the VTF issue with the Terminator is a bit different that what you have solved with the TT2. |
@terry9 Fascinating choice for the wand! Panzerholz is reputed to be a very stable wood species. Had you ever considered ebony ( environmental concerns aside )? Is the wand perforated to reduce mass? The tapped alum disc is a nice touch. Would it be possible to link to an image of the wooden wand? Very curious. Being new to the Terminator, I finally changed cartridge last week from a ZYX Ulitmate 1000, 5g, to a Audio Tekne MC6310, 7-8g ( ?). It was rough going to get the cartridge to track properly. Two issues: One as to do with the wand and the brass counterweights and the second was pump and surge tanks. I had to remove one of the smaller surge tanks to restore enough pressure to allow proper tracking. And while making adjustments, I thought that a stone body Koetsu, 10+g, would be a nightmare to install. More research on pumps and surge tanks required! @terry9 What kind of issues were you having before the Panzholz wand? A Koetsu Stone will be an eventual purchase for me. I’d appreciate your input. |
Ledoux, Panzerholz is a trade name for an exotic German plywood: half millimetre slices of beech hardwood embedded in a matrix of phenolic resin. It’s dead, dead, dead. I built the wand out of blocks of 3/4" thick ply, epoxied together to form a stick, then shaped. Actually, I had that done for me because you need carbide tools and/or the kind of skill that comes from daily practice to shape the stuff without making a mess. The pivot was made from a 0.375" bar of Nickel Silver, and the screws were Vic’s nylon. My Koetsu is the Rosewood Signature Platinum with diamond cantilever. Another thread discussing K’s leads to the conclusion that the diamond cantilever is the last big jump in the K line, not the stone bodies, which are fine, but relatively less important. The Tomahawk wand is good, but wasn’t made for a 12g cartridge. It needs weights and damping material hanging off it, it looks plain messy. Also, on some recordings there appears to be some distortion which won’t go away, so I thought I’d try changing the wand. That’s not intended as a criticism of the Terminator, I still think that it’s the best deal in high end - just that I want the performance of a 70,000 Euro SAT. I’m also going to try a more exotic captured bearing design, which should allow very fine adjustments to be made easily. That’s in the future, but I’m having some parts fabricated now. Wish me luck! |
'Another thread discussing K’s leads to the conclusion that the diamond cantilever is the last big jump in the K line, not the stone bodies, which are fine, but relatively less important' Terry, Correct me if I'm wrong but isn't the stone body with the diamond cantilever the end of the line for Koetsu? 'Panzerholz is a trade name for an exotic German plywood: half millimetre slices of beech hardwood embedded in a matrix of phenolic resin. It’s dead, dead, dead." Got it. Seriously, Is there anyway you can link a photograph of the panzerholz wand. ' The Tomahawk wand is good, but wasn’t made for a 12g cartridge. It needs weights and damping material hanging off it, it looks plain messy. Also, on some recordings there appears to be some distortion which won’t go away' I gathered that the latest carbon fiber wand had not graced your system? But in terms of mass and damping for a heavier cartridge, carbon fiber probably does help. |
@ledoux1238, Thanks very much for your reply. The CA TT2 is as you describe it except that the wires are attached in one place to the tonearm carriage and from there to the shielded part of the cable which is anchored to the arm carrier. The wires are not threaded through the tube. In that respect it can be identical to the Terminator (or vice versa). The TT2 also has varying VTF using any normal gage. The only significant difference I can see is the flexibility of the wires. I will wait until I get my Terminator installed before trying to explain the gage again. On another subject, I asked Andrey about using the arm with a heavy cartridge like my Clearaudio GFS or the Ortofon MC Anna, both of which weigh about 16 grams. He replied: “The tonearm works perfectly with Ortofon Anna at the setup of my bosom friend.” Are users with the CF arm having issues with heavier cartridges. Which cartridges over 7 grams will work best; which cartridges have problems? Any comments would be appreciated. Don |
