Jolida, in my experience, is a great company with cool stuff…an integrated amp with remote can be inexpensive new or used.
Looking to get into tubes on the cheap
My current set-up is Tekton Design Electrons with an Hsu VT-15H subwoofer and a Denon AVR-2200w receiver. I am interested in entering the tube world. I have always run SS/receiver to listen to music so I am a total rookie with tubes. Here is what I would like to have. I use my system for 2.0 and 2.1 music, HT 5.1 going to 5.1.4, and basic TV viewing. I would like to keep my receiver in the chain and add tubes and somehow have some kind of switching. Would like to be able to listen to 2.1 and then push something on my Harmony remote to switch between music and HT set-up without having to touch wires. Read many different thread as well as this one. I am not wanting to spend thousands to achieve this but I also want it to sound better than my current SS sound on a 2.1 set-up. Seen the various posts and opinions on tubed preamp vs amp and still after reading all that don't know which one is more beneficial. Looked at Aric's Ultimate but that is more than I am wanting to spend. Looked at Monoprices 50wpc hybrid tubed preamp and ss amp combo. Not sure I want my tubed stuff to come from the place I get me cables but it seems to get good reviews from people who have purchased and it is $170. Also looked at Gemtune X-1 integrated tube amp and Nobsound MS-10D hybrid tube amp. Can I get some guidance on this? Ultimately I am just wanting to improve my 2.1 listening experience.
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@jcarman721, I did a search for the specs of your HT receiver. It does not have multi-channel pre-outs, just pre-outs for the .2 subwoofer channels. With no pre-outs, I don't know how you can integrate it into your proposed 2 channel rig and have it switch between 2.0/2.1/5.1 without moving cables. Sorry, but I don't think it's going to work for you unless you replace the receiver with one that has pre-outs, at least for the L&R front speakers.. Sorry if I've missed something, or don't understand your setup. However, I don't think it's going to work as you envision. I've had mixed/combo 2-channel systems and 5.1 channels systems on multiple occasions in the past and they all used the L&R front pre-outs from the HT receiver going into an input on the 2-channel integrated amp or 2-channel pre-amp. Search on my user name for old posts regarding the subject..... |
@reubent here is a diagram of the back of the unit. http://manuals.denon.com/AVRX2200W/EU/EN/fig/Name%20Rear%20Small1%20X2200E2_DRDZILrknilyjc.png |
@jcarman721 - Hummm, OK. The spec's on the Denon website say "Multi-channel preouts 0.2" which implies that there are only 2 subwoofer pre-outs. When I go to an image of the back of the unit, I do see the 2 sub pre-outs as well as a pair of Zone 2 pre-outs. Is there a set of pre-outs for the multi-channel? If not, I still don't think it's going to work because when you select zone 2 for output, I think it's going to down-mix everything to 2 channels. Am I missing something? |
I would like to keep my receiver in the chain and add tubes and somehow have some kind of switching. Would like to be able to listen to 2.1 and then push something on my Harmony remote to switch between music and HT set-up without having to touch wires.Niles audio SAS-1 is what you need! Make sure to add two150ohm 10W resistors across the speaker post on tube amp side. SET tube amplifier is addictive: https://www.amazon.com/MS-650B-Single-Integrated-Amplifier-Control/dp/B011BNO5UK |
You're going to have to swap out your receiver for the system to work how you're intending, and since those with multi-channel pre-outs tend to be better than the models without, you might improve your 2-channel listening a decent amount with that move alone. Each company tends to have a "house sound" so since you aren't happy with the sound of your Denon, it's possible you'd prefer another brand. Try looking for a place to buy that will let you audition a few or at least has a decent return policy if possible. I could be wrong, but I also think you're limited to 5.2.2 atmos setups with that particular receiver so if you're planning 5.1.4, thats another reason to upgrade the receiver first...unfortunately a receiver upgrade is going to cost you more than the tube amps you mentioned, but its really the only way to get everything you're wanting. Goodluck. |
Years ago my quest for a tube power amp led to to talking to the Jolida guys in MD, including the owner Michael Allen, and I became convinced they knew how to put together a great amp. The amp I bought, a "factory modded" 502P power amp, was a trouble free joy to listen to, cost around 1000 bucks (5 years ago or so), and nothing around at that time came close to the bang for the buck this amp provided. I've since moved on to a single ended power amp, but Jolida still makes cool stuff (Chinese sourced, USA tweaked). |
An EE friend of mine build me a speaker switch so that my Focal speakers could be easily shared between my Integra receiver and the Yaquin tube amplifier. It allows me to just flip the speakers while keeping a load on the tube amplifier so that I don’t have to power cycle it nearly as much and allows me to use it more. |
Sorry for a third reply, but your post sounds somewhat close to my experience. I think you’d benefit more from a better receiver than adding inexpensive tubes to your current setup. I would look for a receiver that has pre-outs and is also 4 ohm stable. I really think being 4 ohm stable is a solid indicator of a quality receiver. I have been impressed with my Integra as a home theater receiver and am now experiencing their great customer support. They have taking my receiver back for repairs at no cost to me and it’s well over double the advertised warranty period. |
You may want to checkout the new Outlaw Audio stereo receiver recently getting solid reviews in Stereophile and other pubs. It has high power, is stable with 4 ohm loads and has a good complement of inputs and capabilities and downstream flexibility. It's $799 sold direct with a generous return policy. I heard the prior model and was always impressed. Seems to punch above its weight and is designed for audio not AV. The prior model was manufactured by ATI which builds for a number of high end brands. |
I'm in the same boat. I have the 2200W and I'm looking to add a integrated amp or power amp to drive the Hologram M4 speakers. I'm using Rogue Ares as phono stage. I was researching and I think the best way is to add a switcher as https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00LNOAGZQ/_encoding=UTF8?coliid=I1W5UP80LZBHX0&colid=2X6K38KCTYS9Q between the Amp and the receiver. That way you don't need to change the receiver and you sound path is cleaner and simpler. IMO it should work for you too |
Using a speaker switcher in revert can manually do the switching between AVR and
integrated amp, but have to be sure that it won't accidentally push the buttons to A+B on the amp switching side! And most of the tube amp need to has a load on output when power ON, So add a 150ohm 10W resistor across each the tube amp outputs is a good " insurance " |
So add a150ohm 10W resistor across each the tube amp outputs is a good " insuranceI guess that's a good idea, even thought I don't know exactly how to do that, I'll research more. Do you have any link or doc where I can see how to do it? |
Most of the tube amp need to has a load on output when it is ON, So add a 150ohm 10W resistor across each the tube amp outputs is a good " insurance "https://robrobinette.com/images/Audio/RobinetteBoxPanel.jpg |
@papalotes
Are those resistors welded or just screed on the RCA plug?http://www.alltraxinc.com/images/Resistor.JPG |
You can find "tube" audio gear at any price ranging from under $100 to all your bank account. But if high power is not a requirement, there are some very good tube power amps or integrated amps for under $1500 new. Much more options for used. By the way, Atma-Sphere or Manley may not be Rolex but they are certainly not Seiko or Timex. |
I just picked up a GemTune GS-01 tube integrated that runs EL34’s in SE Ultralinear mode for 8 wpc. It came with an upgraded Alps Blue Velvet volume pot and TungSol 6SL7’s and an SED winged C 5U4 rectifier tube as well. With my speakers, I think I like the original no name rectifier tube. For the money, this sounds pretty darn good, but the upgrades have definitely taken this up a few notches I’m sure.... |
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I picked up a used Jolida Fusion preamp last summer for about $700 and put it in my bedroom system (Integra 80.3 AVP and Wyred4Sound ST-1000 MK2 amp) and it provided an improvement over the 2 channel audio of the Integra, not a dramatic one though. The Fusion has a home theater bypass function so you should be able to switch it between your receiver for 2 channel and home theater. In my main system I have a Modwright LS100 for 2 channel and the sound quality is dramatically better than my Marantz AV7704 AVP. Unless you score a nice used preamp at a below market price you're probably not going to realize much of an improvement if your budget is under $500. |