"Original" equipment vs. upgraded equipment


Hi,

I've always been curious as to why this is so important...at least to some folks? I've even seen one ad that stated: "born that way and not an upgrade". (Give me break.) As long as the equipment was upgraded by the OEM and brought up to current specs, what difference would it make, sonically or otherwise? Do people really believe that an upgraded piece of equipment is somehow inferior to a non upgraded piece? Can you hear a difference? Will it not last as long?  Please do tell. Thanks.
grk
At least to me, an upgrade is a change in the internals of a unit developed by (and in many cases done by) the manufacturer. Like the Vandersteen 3 to 3A to 3A Sig or a VAC Ren 30/30 to a 30/30 Sig. In my mind, the value of such units is increased as they are brought to more current designs and parts.

Yes, the value is increased, no doubt, but not up to the level of an original Vandersteen 3A Sig or VAC Rev 30/30 Sig in your stated case.


Look at what @oregonpapa  did:
I owned the REF-75. Replaced the KT-120’s with the KT-150 for a nice upgrade. When ARC came out with the REF-75-SE I sold the REF-75 and bought a new REF-75-SE. 

There is a reason for this, and I just did something similar.
I just bought an original ARC Ref 5SE, and now have my ARC Ref 5 up for sale.
It would have cost me another $2,000 to have ARC perform the upgrade to 5SE, and even then, they are only upgrading some of the internal parts (maybe 20%).
When I am buying used items, I always get the serial number to look at the age and service history of a component.
Eg: I would rather buy a 3 year old original component than a 7 year old component that was upgraded 3 years ago, as would most others. 
The 3 year old original will have more value on the used market than the 7 year old upgraded version.

Bottom line: Updating a few of the parts doesn't make it equal to a newer unit. Hence the value of an original unit is greater on the used market than even a unit upgraded to current standard.
The value of an upgrade has a great deal to do with who is upgrading it and the degree to which it is being upgraded.  The upgrades I mentioned in my previous post involved new circuit boards, replacing the originals with upgraded capacitors, resistors etc.  You need to discuss the upgrade with the upgrader and get to specifics of what improvements they can offer at what price point to evaluate the overall value to you, the owner, of that upgrade.  

Since ARC does a lot of model upgrades, let me tell you what they did that I found unbelievably unethical . It was in the 1990's; maybe they have abandoned the practice.

When ARC discontinued the LS-2B MK.2 pre-amp (originally listing at $2995), their dealers were allowed to buy from the factory and then sell to their customers ARC's remaining stock of "Factory Reconditioned" units in sealed boxes for $1995. Great I thought, and bought one. After all those units had been sold, ARC sent their dealers the remaining stock of new (as opposed to "Factory Reconditioned") LS-2B Mk.2's. I found that to be lacking in integrity; how 'bout you?

I felt betrayed and taken advantage of. What ARC could and should have done is offer both new and Factory Reconditioned LS-2B MK.2's at the same time, the Factory Reconditioned units at a lower price than the new. THAT would have been the honorable, ethical way to sell off their remaining stock of the discontinued model. I lost a lot of respect for ARC by them acting this way; how 'bout you?

bdp243,300 posts

When ARC discontinued the LS-2B MK.2 pre-amp (originally listing at $2995), their dealers were allowed to buy from the factory and then sell to their customers ARC's remaining stock of "Factory Reconditioned" units in sealed boxes for $1995. Great I thought, and bought one. After all those units had been sold, ARC sent their dealers the remaining stock of new (as opposed to "Factory Reconditioned") LS-2B Mk.2's. I found that to be lacking in integrity; how 'bout you

 I don't see anything wrong with that at all.


I do not have any problem purchasing equipment upgraded by the manufacturer.  An Audio Research REF 250 amp upgraded by Audio Research to a REF 250 SE means that not only did Audio Research upgrade the device, the changed the faceplate and whatever they needed to do to make it basically a REF 250 SE.  they also service checked the amp to make sure it operates within their specifications and standards. Who better to check this?  It is now a REF 250 SE amp. 

Maybe the sale price would be slightly lower than an original REF 250 SE amp.  

equipment upgraded by anyone other than the manufacturer would require some more investigation on my part. 

I for one do not purchase with resale in mind.  I purchase based on my musical/audio needs at the time.

I upgrade and modify equipment often.  for example, there are much better more linear transistors available now than in the past.  So if the transistors have the same specifications, but are much more linear, that is a natural replacement.   On my Bedini 250/250 MKII amp, I have upgraded/modified by replacing all the output transistors with much better more linear transistors and also the drivers.  I now have separate power supplies for each channel with much more power supply capacitance and bypass capacitors also.  I installed a slow start circuit, installed Threshold like monster heat sinks, removed the speaker fuses, used Cardas internal wiring, new/better power cord, individual rail fuse protection.

I spoke with John Bedini while I was doing this (before he passed) and he liked my ideas.  He even searched through his storage facility and found some unstuffed circuit boards that I could use.  I increased the bias and this amp really sings. 

Is it original?  nope.  If I were to sell it, I would make sure the buyer knew about the upgrades/modifications.  It is my backup amp to my two Audio Research REF 250 amps and my Mark Levinson 23.5 amp. 

I've done similar work with Robertson Amps and many Threshold amps.

enjoy