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"Original" equipment vs. upgraded equipment

Hi,

I've always been curious as to why this is so important...at least to some folks? I've even seen one ad that stated: "born that way and not an upgrade". (Give me break.) As long as the equipment was upgraded by the OEM and brought up to current specs, what difference would it make, sonically or otherwise? Do people really believe that an upgraded piece of equipment is somehow inferior to a non upgraded piece? Can you hear a difference? Will it not last as long?  Please do tell. Thanks.
grk
bdp24's avatar
bdp24
9,419 posts
 

Since ARC does a lot of model upgrades, let me tell you what they did that I found unbelievably unethical . It was in the 1990's; maybe they have abandoned the practice.

When ARC discontinued the LS-2B MK.2 pre-amp (originally listing at $2995), their dealers were allowed to buy from the factory and then sell to their customers ARC's remaining stock of "Factory Reconditioned" units in sealed boxes for $1995. Great I thought, and bought one. After all those units had been sold, ARC sent their dealers the remaining stock of new (as opposed to "Factory Reconditioned") LS-2B Mk.2's. I found that to be lacking in integrity; how 'bout you?

I felt betrayed and taken advantage of. What ARC could and should have done is offer both new and Factory Reconditioned LS-2B MK.2's at the same time, the Factory Reconditioned units at a lower price than the new. THAT would have been the honorable, ethical way to sell off their remaining stock of the discontinued model. I lost a lot of respect for ARC by them acting this way; how 'bout you?

Ag insider logo xs@2x
cleeds
5,647 posts
 
bdp243,300 posts

When ARC discontinued the LS-2B MK.2 pre-amp (originally listing at $2995), their dealers were allowed to buy from the factory and then sell to their customers ARC's remaining stock of "Factory Reconditioned" units in sealed boxes for $1995. Great I thought, and bought one. After all those units had been sold, ARC sent their dealers the remaining stock of new (as opposed to "Factory Reconditioned") LS-2B Mk.2's. I found that to be lacking in integrity; how 'bout you

 I don't see anything wrong with that at all.
minorl
1,014 posts
 

I do not have any problem purchasing equipment upgraded by the manufacturer.  An Audio Research REF 250 amp upgraded by Audio Research to a REF 250 SE means that not only did Audio Research upgrade the device, the changed the faceplate and whatever they needed to do to make it basically a REF 250 SE.  they also service checked the amp to make sure it operates within their specifications and standards. Who better to check this?  It is now a REF 250 SE amp. 

Maybe the sale price would be slightly lower than an original REF 250 SE amp.  

equipment upgraded by anyone other than the manufacturer would require some more investigation on my part. 

I for one do not purchase with resale in mind.  I purchase based on my musical/audio needs at the time.

I upgrade and modify equipment often.  for example, there are much better more linear transistors available now than in the past.  So if the transistors have the same specifications, but are much more linear, that is a natural replacement.   On my Bedini 250/250 MKII amp, I have upgraded/modified by replacing all the output transistors with much better more linear transistors and also the drivers.  I now have separate power supplies for each channel with much more power supply capacitance and bypass capacitors also.  I installed a slow start circuit, installed Threshold like monster heat sinks, removed the speaker fuses, used Cardas internal wiring, new/better power cord, individual rail fuse protection.

I spoke with John Bedini while I was doing this (before he passed) and he liked my ideas.  He even searched through his storage facility and found some unstuffed circuit boards that I could use.  I increased the bias and this amp really sings. 

Is it original?  nope.  If I were to sell it, I would make sure the buyer knew about the upgrades/modifications.  It is my backup amp to my two Audio Research REF 250 amps and my Mark Levinson 23.5 amp. 

I've done similar work with Robertson Amps and many Threshold amps.

enjoy

bdp24's avatar
bdp24
9,419 posts
 
cleeds, I inadvertently left out the fact that the Factory Reconditioned LS-2B Mk.2 were sold for $1995. Then, only after all of them were sold did ARC sent the remaining brand new, never owned, non-reconditioned LS-2B Mk.2’s to their dealers, who sold them for the same $1995. You think it’s fine to wait to send out brand new LS-2B’s until after all the reconditioned LS-2B’s are sold? And to charge the same for both new and reconditioned units? I don’t. If you walked in to a shop buy an LS-2B, and the retailer had two of them, one brand new, the other reconditioned, and they were both priced at $1995, you wouldn’t prefer to buy the new one? You think a reconditioned LS-2B is the "same" as a new/never owned one, and the two should be sold at the same price? I don’t. If I had known that brand new LS-2B’s were going to be available at $1995 after all the reconditioned LS-2B’s were sold for the same amount, I would have waited. Anyone and everyone would, that's why they kept it a secret. So they could get as much for the reconditioned LS-2B's as for the new. I find that a cynical deception of consumers---unethical, disrespectful, and insulting.
grk OP
200 posts
 
"In this example I would say that though the upgraded unit may sound the same, the original 75SE will have greater resale value on the used market.

Why? Because in the upgrade process, only certain parts are being upgraded, not the whole amp. So if you are buying an upgraded used 75SE, 70% of your parts may be a couple/few years older than a used original 75SE."

I'm not so sure that would make a big difference, even over the long haul...unless the capacitors, etc., were very old to begin with. Also, as someone else pointed out...there is always a big depreciation on new gear. It's usually cheaper to upgrade.
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