Ortofon Red on Thorens TP16 tonearm

Has anyone used the Ortofon Red, Blue, Bronze, or
Black on a TP16? Using the Baerwald Arc Protractor, I am unable to get the proper angle on the cartridge due to the lip on the headshell. Anyone else had this issue?
My Brother uses the Ortofon Bronze with this tonearm and he loves it. He uses a AYON Intgrated tube amp with JBL Century 100's. My other brother uses this same tonearm and has the GRADO Prestige wood body (this IS the cartridge for the TP16, IMO) he has the high output one, but they make a low output as well. His system is all McIntosh and Dynaudio speakers. Also, You can use other methods for alignment, like a GEO disk or something like that.
The Red should be fine. This arm isn't good enough to justify spending on the higher priced cartridges.
Cheaper Nagoka's esp. the MP 110 work great on this arm.
"This arm isn't good enough to justify spending on the higher priced cartridges"......... I find this is not true If you have upgraded the tables wiring and possibly rewired the TP16 also. This Arm can then be used with the cartridges mentioned and it WILL sound very engaging. DO not use any Nagaoka as they come across very mediocre and bland on this TP16 (Nagaoka makes great carts). THE cartridge for this tone arm IS a GRADO Prestige wood body. (high or low output) Spend the $ on one and you will be amazed at the performance you can achieve with this tone arm.
So it is true if you haven't upgraded the wiring? ;-)
In your opinions, does the lower mass Mk II arm raise the bar?
At least upgrade the wiring to the turntable. And replace the power cord as well. This is a must for all old tables anyway. It will prove itself with great results. Lower mass arms are not always better. Cartridge matching would be critical IMO.
The Shure M97xe with Jico SAS stylus is great with the TP16. The body of the cart required some minor filing along the screw recesses to achieve the arc alignment. It tracks everything with ease and once broken in, (about 50 hours) it sings.

I used an Ortofon 2M Red with a Thorens TD-145 with TP-16 tonearm,  and then tried a AT120E, then upgraded  the cartridge using the stylus  for  AT 440MLb cartridge ( they use the same body) The  RED  sounded OK, and the AT120 a bit  better, but the real change can when switching to the Audio technica 440MLb. 

Let me be honest, none of the above cartridges (I believe ) demonstrated their peak potential; it is not the  the cartridges, but the lousy tonearm, TP-16. The tracking and anti-skating devices are toys and also inaccurate. I used a Geo-Disc to set up the tonearm which has always been reliable.

Using the standard Thorens headshell is also a joke. Cartridges must be mounted from the bottom up , unless you tear off the tin logo top and attempted to mount it from above, but that is a chore. The ceramic block inside the headshell makes mounting from the bottom up difficult. and   also DOES NOT allow for accurate adjustment of VTA or azimuth. 

Don't waste any more money on your Thorens, go with the Ortofon 2M  RED which is inexpensive, and then sell the package and move to a better table like Merrill  "Gem Dandy" turntable, or a Music Hall 7.3 which is -packaged with an  Ortofon Bronze.   Good Luck


Sunnyjim.....The Ortofon Black is even better....the Ortofon Windield, better still, etc., etc.