2. amps-preamps
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Tube Preamp, Amp or Int for holographic imaging?

I am pretty new to High end, but was drawn to it after hearing some music with a holographic soundstage. Since then I've been on a quest to reproduce it in my own apartment.

I listen exclusively to vinyl music at home(nothing against CDs, I just personally find Vinyl more charming and collectible), and am currently hooked up to a Planar 3. I am using my home theater receiver as an amplifier, since I don't yet have a second system.

I've been using the Graham Slee Era Gold V for a preamp. It sounds great in everything except its ability to project the sound forward and leave the notes hanging in the air (at least on my system). My main goal in audio is, at present, getting that holographic soundstage, and I have read that tube amps do it best. My main question is, would it be enough to switch the phono preamp to a tube (probably the EAR or anything else someone wants to recommend), or should you have both preamp and amp be tube? In that case, what would be a good integrated for exclusively vinyl under $1k used (Jolida is the only well reviewed one I know of)?

Finally I have played around extensively with speaker placement, and some dampening. I get 'some' sense of depth (maybe imagined), but the images rarely seem to suspend in air. Also, the music still seems to come from behind the speakers most of the time, and I feel if I could just get the voice and front instrumentals to jump forward a foot or so I'd be perfectly happy.

Thanks for reading, any input is welcome.
superapplekid
unsound
7,311 posts
 
Anothr nod to Tvad on this one.
tbromgard
814 posts
 
Try speaker placement and room treatment. Divide the room in 5ths. Place speakers in first 1/5 and your listening chair in the last 1/5 section. Make sense? Then take a hand hald mirror and while sitting in your listening chair, have a friend place the mirror on the wall near the right speaker. Then move the mirror along the wall until you can see the speaker in the mirrow while sitting in your chair. This is the first order sound wave-put a wall covering there. For better results, cont along the wall until you see the left speaker in the mirror-this is the second order wave-use wall treatment there too. Then do other side. You will be amazed at the results.
superapplekid OP
2 posts
 
These are all very helpful responses. I thought the imagining might be unobtainable 'until' I got tube amps based on some of my reading, so its reassuring the hear that they can only help it in the end.

That said, I am using Boston Acoustic VR3s for speakers. They're home theater floorstanding, and I imagine they aren't built for the kind of music demands I was seeking. I'm considering trying to start a separate system for two channel with some cheap (>=$500, <$1000) speakers. Monitors and Magnepans seems to get a lot of praise for their 'holographic' imaging. Of course, I'm trying very hard to identify if there's an intersection between my budget and audio goals at the moment, and also how best to obtain those goals.

Also, thanks Tbromgard, since I have never heard that treatment trick before and will have to try it. I thought I had played around with placement/*fuax* treatment until my head was spinning, but I guess people aren't exaggerating when they talk about how much you need to play around with it.
sufentanil's avatar
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sufentanil
782 posts
 
Superapplekid, I've heard some Boston Acoustics (a model similar to the VR3 I think) and, at least with the setup I heard them in, I wasn't too impressed with the sound or the soundstaging.

If you have a relatively small room, and you're after holographic imaging, you can get some used Totem Arro's in your price range. They will present you with the most three-dimensional imaging you've ever heard. If you get tubes in the amplification, then you'll be even better. My experience was best with a Jolida 302b integrated amp with these speakers. It's hard to bear for the price.

Other options would include some high-quality monitors, such as JMLab Electra 906, PSB stratus mini, or Paradigm Studio 20's. (Hey, I did include at least one non-Canadian speaker!) My experience is that all other things being equal, the monitors tend to soundstage better than floorstanders at the same price.

I do recommend that you start with your speakers, and then with the positioning within the room.

Good luck!

Michael
cerrot's avatar
cerrot
1,700 posts
 
I have a pair of VR 4's (use them for the rear channels on HT). I kniw what Sufentanil means about the soundstage but I have a pair of Paradigm Atoms at work and have managed to ave them image well and throw a believable, holographic soundtage, so it is possible with entry level speakers. Just takes time, paitience, a little knowledge and luck.
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