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Turntable advice / opinion on setup / sound.

Hello all you analog experts. I am seeking some advice, opinions and direction to try, based on my tastes and setup. 

I’m not loving my current TT sound but there are variables that could cause this. For reference, my favorite TT I ever owned was the ClearAudio Champion Level 2 (wish I never sold it) because it was warm and had a huge stage. 

  1. I listen to every style of music, smooth jazz to hard metal. 
  2. I have to turn the volume way up to get the get the level I like which at times has hiss and a tiny bit of hum. Compared to digital sources which have none of these issues. 
  3. I find this setup to lack huge stage and warmth. 

My current system is:

  1. Rega Planar 8 w/ Alpheta 2 MC cart.  
  2. Cambridge Audio -> Alva Duo Phono Pre amp
  3. Mark Levinson -> No 585 Amp. 
  4. Martin Logan 15a Renaissance -> 8FT apart/ 3ft off the front wall and 3 FT from each side wall. I sit 9FT away from the speakers.  

The turntables I am considering are:

1) Musical Fidelity -> M8XTT

What cart would you use?

2) Michell Audio -> Gyro SE Turntable

3) Clear Audio Champion Level 2

Thank you all in advance for any guidance and opinions you can offer. 

necrosuit
oberoniaomnia
352 posts
 

Agree on PS as weak link. As you use a MC cart, also consider SUT route. With an SUT with adjustable gain (e.g. Zesto) you can play with various gain settings at SUT, PS, Preamp to dial in sound you like.

necrosuit OP
17 posts
 

@thecarpathian Ha! Thanks man! Had this name for over 30 years. :)

Yea, I am sure I will need to do a lot of little tweaking on this new setup. 

tablejockey
4,403 posts
 

"As you use a MC cart, also consider SUT route"

The Chinook has sufficient gain to drive the OP's highly rated Apheta.

It will now perform and be heard as intended.

Between the Apheta and the LVB, the Apheta should have more desireable performance traits. 

What's "better"is for OP's ears to decide.

elliottbnewcombjr
7,744 posts
 

Your TT’s Manual, doesn’t tell you much

https://www.rega.co.uk/download/pl8-multi-lingual-manual.pdf

Your arm height is fixed, and your cartridge body height is designed specifically for that arm, so you do not need to set arm height/vta/sra, that is very nice.

You need to ascertain 3 measurements for any tonearm:

a. overhang

b. inner null point distance

c. outer null point distance

Can anybody give us those answers for OP’s Rega Planar 8  ______?

.....................................................

I put this together a year ago, some of the links may not work, if not, let me know, I’ll get updated links. I tried to keep it short.

CARTRIDGE ALIGNMENT

I confirmed this once again with Steve and Ray Leung at VAS recently:

Makers, rebuilders, re-tippers frequently note that the majority of cartridges/styluses they work on are worn mostly on one side (improper azimuth and/or either too little or too much anti-skate).

Those are sent in by us, knowledgeable and experienced audiophiles, sending expensive cartridges that have been played on audiophile equipment, set up by experts on precision tonearms. Not amateurs, US!

So: After everything else, it is about anti-skate. Inward Skate is a natural force, unavoidable, and anti-skate is needed to properly ‘oppose’ it. This is one of the reasons I prefer light tracking cartridges.

Despite denials that anti-skate makes much difference, it is vital to get it right!

I used dials for many years, and discovered none were giving proper calibrations. I now use separate tools and my ears, resulting in the stylus essentially floating free to react to information on either side of the groove. Not just sound/imaging: It is important to avoid wear on the inward edge of the stylus and LP’s groove, for long stylus life, reducing wear of grooves, avoiding ‘bending/twisting’ the cantilever, and when right we do get proper imaging of the content. Excessive outer force transfers the problem to the other edge.

  1. TOOLS

 

  1. Level, 1.8”, leave on the Turntable

 

https://www.amazon.com/Triangle-precision-universal-household-mounting/dp/B09VBWWVDW/ref=sr_1_8?crid=TL2RCTVFGS1S&dib=eyJ2IjoiMSJ9.7-QuBjdTkYztPIB2oY6k6Kt-fPCugCSMUsP1LtkO37NB4L7m3Fs44xnt3rQtc6vt4ZpbcMEbgzjQOY6RnIf1EToz7xOo8P2HmU9Nl4_iNTVgUYd9gw1fjFBz8Jss8ZALrIeGBqA3S_rGiTr674bVlr6sc_Rr8jAxg4kanyk8Lj_bY3z-ExMDRG2Cp6JvU7XSMBxdUzwqVtUECKrSuLbDnD47H8FzgiO8leI1Rn-I4JVKMHCMAFWnSA0g0j94elKPzbzc4voqCFrb7nESmUkrIoiq2fZU0Od6M2d274s1xec.Xzp0SVUYO5-cvU9nn4LUevN1YLx_dYGNU4N4oH6orwg&dib_tag=se&keywords=precision%2Bbubble%2Blevel%2Btriangle&qid=1760135036&sprefix=precision%2Bbubble%2Blevel%2Btriangle%2Caps%2C89&sr=8-8&th=1

 

  1. Small Bubble Levels, small and light enough to leave on top of the headshell (not armwand) above the cartridge. I use tiny specks of poster tack to keep them on. Set tracking force when they are in place.

 

https://www.amazon.com/Circular-Bullseye-Inclinometers-Phonograph-Turntable/dp/B07NRG8HX6/ref=rvi_d_sccl_1/137-6608249-9510222?pd_rd_w=1u75O&content-id=amzn1.sym.f5690a4d-f2bb-45d9-9d1b-736fee412437&pf_rd_p=f5690a4d-f2bb-45d9-9d1b-736fee412437&pf_rd_r=P9QNJM1X3H7NYP7RF98M&pd_rd_wg=w6G3g&pd_rd_r=9f5f8118-c1d5-4abe-8c83-7555a1d69f3e&pd_rd_i=B07NRG8HX6&th=1

  1. Digital Tracking Force Scale

https://www.amazon.com/DIGITNOW-Precise-Turntable-Backlight-Cartridge/dp/B08DLJ676B/ref=rvi_d_sccl_2/137-6608249-9510222?pd_rd_w=MPhhL&content-id=amzn1.sym.f5690a4d-f2bb-45d9-9d1b-736fee412437&pf_rd_p=f5690a4d-f2bb-45d9-9d1b-736fee412437&pf_rd_r=30VA7TX1KX4NJT87Y3QG&pd_rd_wg=0NqxH&pd_rd_r=f48bc875-ef8a-4936-b551-e97f23a2fc77&pd_rd_i=B08DLJ676B&psc=1

  1. LP” Protractor One Side’ Blank Other Side

 

https://www.amazon.com/Ragyzity-Protractor-Anti-Sliding-Calibration-Accessories/dp/B0DR5TLCNJ/ref=rvi_d_sccl_1/137-6608249-9510222?pd_rd_w=adR1Z&content-id=amzn1.sym.f5690a4d-f2bb-45d9-9d1b-736fee412437&pf_rd_p=f5690a4d-f2bb-45d9-9d1b-736fee412437&pf_rd_r=QAN6E4B7DFAFN947CVZR&pd_rd_wg=2gW4g&pd_rd_r=4d1f8919-ebec-47d5-9c11-8c4c18bf96d1&pd_rd_i=B0DR5TLCNJ&psc=1

 

d. Mirror to Set Azimuth.

https://www.amazon.com/Plymor-Rectangle-Beveled-Glass-Mirror/dp/B07T31MRZ9/ref=rvi_d_sccl_4/137-6608249-9510222?pd_rd_w=fhw0Z&content-id=amzn1.sym.f5690a4d-f2bb-45d9-9d1b-736fee412437&pf_rd_p=f5690a4d-f2bb-45d9-9d1b-736fee412437&pf_rd_r=T83S967V9P8FSXKXWR94&pd_rd_wg=nY6Jx&pd_rd_r=e1e8081d-d9ac-4049-b25f-1f7847620a28&pd_rd_i=B07T31MRZ9&th=1

  1. 30X Magnifying Mirror with Light, keep on TT below the cartridge, view the stylus and angle it to see the entire length of the cantilever into the suspension pocket.

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0CLLZYBVK?ref_=ppx_hzsearch_conn_dt_b_fed_asin_title_1&th=1

  1. Music to confirm system L/R balance/imaging (3 guitarists play last two tracks only)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Friday_Night_in_San_Francisco

  1. Use CD version to confirm all system connections are good for L/R Balance
  2. AFTER 1 above, Use LP version to refine anti-skate by ear

 

ADJUSTMENTS

  1. Arm Height for VTA.

anti-skate to zero; desired tracking force applied. Adjust arm height so arm is parallel to the LP/platter when stylus is lowered into the groove and the cantilever’s suspension is loaded by the tracking force.

 

  1. Overhang Distance and Two Null Points (arm specific, find settings online)

 

Set overhang, very lightly tighten; twist cartridge sideways as needed for best compromise of both null point positions.

  1. Azimuth (hopefully it mounts correctly, if not, azimuth is very very important)

Place rectangular mirror on the platter, lower arm, view reflection from front. Any deviation will be reflected in the opposite direction making it easy to see/get right.

 

  1. All is well, if not:
  2. Arm has some adjustability, i.e. a fitting rotates, arm wand rotates, visible or hidden set screw ….
  3. Headshell has adjustability
  4. Thin Shim may need to be added above one side of the cartridge as a last resort. Tedious, but vital.

 

  1. Tracking Force, use digital scale, find specs online, typically set for middle of specified range.

 

  1. Anti-Skate (one hand always on the arm lift lever)

 

  1. Use blank side of LP, raise arm, get platter spinning 33 rpm.
  2. Lower arm, it gets pulled into the center, that is natural skating force
  3. add a little anti-skating force, lower arm, a bit more. Check it at various distances from the outer and inner grooves. Find a compromise, if any allow a speck of inner skate, avoid outer skate.
  4. Final, by ear, using the LP, last 2 tracks, 3 guitarists play, imaging reveals their placement, verify you can hear John in the middle and the others left and right.

 

  1. VTA Refinement, by ear or verify still level with alternate headshell

 

If arm is level when playing, and it sounds great, only perfectionists will make VTA refinements,

 

  1. having invested in tonearms with easy height adjustments, the best mechanisms are smooth enough to adjust while listening, called ‘VTA on the Fly’.

 

  1. Alternate headshell/cartridges. I make quick height adjustments if needed when I change to a headshell with a pre-mounted cartridge.
elliottbnewcombjr
7,744 posts
 

A member here recently posted this, I have not read it yet, keep in mind, it may be old, i.e. digital stylus gauges didn't exist when it was written.

Cartridge Setup

https://www.audiophilia.com/reviews/2016/1/17/a-beginners-guide-to-cartridge-setup

 

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