Why the fascination with subwoofers?

Dear @lewinskih01 : Only common sense. As I posted to you a few months ago that " seller "/atmasphere ( other time I will explain about that word " seller " because it’s no matters in this thread. ) said that his syatem goes down to 20hz no subs needs at all ( in that dicussion what we was discussing was that any passive speakers needs the integration of two self powered subs. ).

His answer ( what he posted in that thread. ) only showed his ignorance of the whole subwoofer/bass management because even his field coil speakers and his system will be improved through the addition of two self powered subs not 4.

Suddenly in this thread he gaves opinions as if he really been a true expert on the whole subject when even today he has no first hand expeiences in his room/system with subs, go figure. From where he already knows for sure what is posting.

I’m not attacking him but only disclosing those facts. That he be a tube electronics manufacturer does not means knows everything about everything in audio because at least in the subs/bass management whole subject it’s ignorant as you, me and any one else are ignorants on several subjects/topics in audio.

Look, I took around 1/one full year to integrate my subs in my room/system. A full year with " thousands " of tests till the subs were very good integrated to.

More than 16 years ago I was thinking exactly as atmasphere that because my ADS L2030 speakers goes down to 18hz I just do not need subs in my system.

I was totally wrong and was till I try and learned about subs that I added to my room/system and igf you look to my subwoofer thread that I posted in the analog forum its date is 2005, this is almost 14 years ago.

The first discovery for me was not if my system bass was now " rigth " but the paramount differences ( for the better ) that makes that I put at minimum the IMD of my ADS L2030 and till today I still think is the main improvement followed by all what we subs owners already experienced with.

No one can try to shows him self as a knowledge man just reading with out first hand experiences in his room/system.

Btw, for me makes no sense to have 3 or 5 bass evenly in any room/system because for the mid and high frequency range exist only one " rigth " seat position no matters what.
What we have to take care in deep is that at our room/listening seat position the bass, mid and high frequency ranges stays spot-on and that’s it.

Two subs are enough to acomplish that. Harman tell us in precise and scientific way: 4 are the ideal but two are enough. Ideal for more seat positions but 90%/95% of the quality performance levels we can accomplish with two subs, yes it will takes a little more time to do it but we can do it.

No, not one full year as I took where the main reason wa that I was totally ignorant on the whole bass regards and I did it alone with no advisors or the like and really was a huge learning lessons because I learned several other audio subjects other that the bass management.

I know that you already has very good knowledge levels with the subs but for new comers about this link could help:

https://www.audioholics.com/home-theater-connection/crawling-for-bass-subwoofer-placement

Regards and enjoy the MUSIC NOT DISTORTIONS,
R.

and he still posting that he needs only two subs because his speakers goes down 20hz ( solid hz. ): so what?, that confirms that he did not understand yet the overall subject in this thread and in the reality of any room/system.

Dear @bdp24  : You are rigth, live event experiences is a must to have and understand the home system bass management.

We need ( as you already have. ) first hand experiences trhough live event experiences seated at nearfield positions ( in different venues. ) to try to approach that live bass experienced.

We always will be not even near the live experiences but at the end the end our target must be to " approach " it.

Maybe the bassm management range in home systems is the most complicated target to achieve in the best way we can. Always will be trade-offs where we have to choose in between.

R.

What bdp24 said, +1. Get around a rhythm section(within 25 feet), that’s played together for any length of time and you’ll understand, "tight Bass". For(most) anyone that’s been around the real thing, for any length of time, it’s mandatory in the listening room. Far as semantics: "tight" generally refers to how cohesive a group sounds. When applied to a system (in my personal thesaurus, anyway), how well the lowest notes are detailed and how easy it is to follow each rhythm section player’s individual lines(given a well mixed/mastered recording, everything in phase and balanced). Then too, there’s the recording venue’s ambiance info, much of which is carried in the lower registers. ie: Dead Can Dance(Spirit Dance/Yulunga, especially) can place one in the Quivvy Church’s auditorium/studio, with the right setup. When I first built my woofer system, it was designed(1980-81) to mate well with my Acoustat Model IIIs. It’s worked seamlessly, with everything(mostly planar) I’ve owned, since(various active crossovers, amps and one driver change, but same transmission line cabinets).

I have to admit that with my Magnepan 20.7's I have toyed with the idea of adding a subwoofer but in the case of the 20.7's in my room they measure flat down to about 28hz and only then start to roll off.  So I would not want to crossover the signal "from" the maggies to a sub, rather I would want to blend a sub in beginning at around that point of 28hz.  BUT of course there's just very little music down there I don't believe however.

@rauliruegas 
You are really mad at Ralph. Oh well...

FWIW:

and he still posting that he needs only two subs because his speakers goes down 20hz ( solid hz. ): so what?, that confirms that he did not understand yet the overall subject in this thread and in the reality of any room/system

I believe he's talking about the same approach Earl Geddes, Hartman, etc do: 4 sources playing subwoofer frequencies to flatten response across multiple seating positions. In his case, per his comments, his mains go down to 20Hz so they are playing in the subwoofer region as well. He will add two subs in parallel to the mains so he will end up with 4 sources playing subwoofer range. That's all. Common sense to me (coupled with some theory/knowledge).