Get the music right and the HT will be fine. I’d go with the 12G no doubt.
Comparing Rythmik F12 and F12G: Which is Better for Music and Movies?
I'm currently in the market for a new subwoofer and I've been eyeing the Rythmik F12 and F12G models. Both seem to offer fantastic performance, but I'm trying to determine which one would be the best fit for my needs, which include a mix of music and movies. After doing some research, I've found some interesting insights that I'd like to share and discuss with you all.
Main Differences:
The primary distinction between these two models lies in their drivers. The F12G utilizes a paper-based driver designed by GR Research, whereas the F12 features Rythmik's standard aluminum driver. According to Rythmik's website, the paper driver is lighter and has a more extended response compared to the aluminum driver. It can handle higher crossover points, making it the preferred choice if you plan to cross above 80 Hz. Additionally, the paper cone's lower mass results in slightly better dynamics at low to moderate output levels. However, it's worth noting that the paper cone is not as stiff as the aluminum driver.
Real-Life Differences:
Now, the question arises: how do these differences translate into real-life performance? Some users have reported that the F12G is the more musical option, with a sound that's often described as fast and dynamic. The paper cone's lighter weight and foam surround are said to allow for deeper bass extension and more excursion, which can contribute to a more immersive listening experience, especially with music. However, the F12G does come with a slightly higher price tag compared to its aluminum driver counterpart.
Pros and Cons:
To summarize, here are some potential pros and cons of each model:
Rythmik F12 (Aluminum Driver):
Pros:
- Stiffer cone for more precise bass control
- Potentially better for movie soundtracks with deep bass effects
- Slightly more affordable option
Cons:
- Limited crossover options due to heavier cone
- May not excel as much in musicality compared to F12G
Rythmik F12G (GR Research Paper Driver):
Pros:
- Lighter cone for faster and more dynamic bass response
- More extended frequency response
- Often praised for its musicality
Cons:
- Higher price point
- Localization issues at higher crossover points (above 80 Hz)
Seeking Input:
I'm really torn between these two models and would love to hear from anyone who has experience with either the F12 or F12G. Can you actually hear the difference in real-world usage? Are there any other factors I should consider before making my decision? Any input or advice would be greatly appreciated!
Thanks in advance for your help!
13 responses Add your response
÷1 @thxbest, I use a combination of two F12Gs and two F18s in one of my rigs. Depending on the content that’s playing, I can switch back and forth or use both. For music, there’s no real beating the F12G. The GR research open baffle sub could give the F12G a run for its money, but, the GR is also a bit of an eyesore (poor waf).
P..S. I have a friend who has the dual opposed G22 and claims it is the best sub on earth (if it fits your budget). But, I have not tried that sub in my rig.
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Good news: You should find that either will make you happy! The difference between the two is relatively minor. I suggest going on the AVS Forum (for Rythmik Audio) and AudioCircle (for GR Research) and read what current owners of both models have to say about each. If you want the lowest inertia drivers and a higher than 80-100Hz crossover frequency, another option is the Rythmik FM8, which features dual 8" woofers. Probably not optimum for movies, however.
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I can vouch for the F12G and Rythmik. I purchased one along with the SVS3000. I kept them both for years before moving on. I'd say out of the 2 the F12G was better and more adjustable. The nice thing about the SVS however is they have an app that offers control on the fly, but FWIW I didn't use it much once it was set up the way I wanted it. |
@bjesien I’d be very interested in your more specific thoughts on the 12G vs. the SVS specifically for music. There are some here who I think have unfairly badmouthed SVS subs for music, and as Rhythmic subs are generally highly regarded for music your impressions and comparisons would be most interesting if you’d be willing to share. Also, and if you don’t mind me asking, what sub(s) did you graduate to after these (if any) and what were the improvements you experienced? Thanks! (My apologies to the OP for this little sidetrack) |
@Soix this was around 8 years ago. I ran them together for years and occasionally would turn one off and run the other. Hard to say but I feel the 12G had more foundation, a greater stability, maybe went a little deeper but probably not. I know what you mean, people get worked up over subs just like they did their favorite cigarettes, with passion and vigor. The only subs I've kind of bad mouthed have been the lower end Rel. They are cheaper than the higher end line and just don't compare to the like of Rhythmic for the price point. I put both on the market at one point when I didn't need them and the 12G sold first. Ended up keeping the SVS but its rarely on. |
@soix I have had sealed SVS subs in the past. The dsp in SVS used to add a bit of delay (could also say the say about Elac or any sub with built-in dsp). This is a non-issue, of course, for someone who has a processor with the ability to delay the main speakers as well. For a purist rig with no such capability, it can come into play. Otherwise, the "sealed" svs subs can offer similar output and extension for a slightly higher price ---> Rythmik, HSU, etc are manufacturer direct (no dealer’s cut to deal with) and SVS is not.... Again, a non-issue considering how much things typically cost in the world of audiophilia. Having said that, SVS can’t get to the infrasonic pounding levels of say the Rythmik 18 inch, F18 (nor any other manufacturer i know of with just a sealed sub). SVS subs seem to place more focus on spl, while you can perceive ’more’ texture, separation, detail, etc with Rythmik, primarily due to the servo controlled drivers that slam stop the driver on a dime. It is NOT a night and day difference (perceptually), but, it is definitely discernible in correctly set up rooms/rigs. If Rythmik didn’t have a restrictive patent, i get the feeling that a lot of manufacturers trying to come up with a "hifi" sub will go in that direction with servo control. Rythmik is...perhaps for a more nit picky OCD dude. The vast majority of the audiophile masses probably couldn’t tell a difference (perceptually) between a properly integrated SVS and Rythmik.
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@deep_333 I would like to know your experience regarding the comparison between the Rythmik F12G and F18 subwoofers, particularly in terms of transient response and overall bass fluidity. My main focus lies in understanding how the Rythmik F12G compares to the F18 in terms of transient response and the fluidity of bass performance. Specifically, I am interested in determining which of the two models would be better suited for a 2-channel setup. I acknowledge that while the F18 boasts a lower frequency response due to its larger surface area and increased power, I am keen to discern any qualitative differences in sound between the two models. Thank you! |
I'm deliberating about the same choice. I consulted with Enrico in Tech Support at Rythmik Audio. He wrote that he would only recommend the F12G if you needed to crossover above 90 Hz. Otherwise, he wrote that there was no difference in output or sound quality between the two. Another point that I read elsewhere (can't verify) was that the F12G had a different, foam surround for the driver, possibly limiting its longevity. Mark
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"Bass fluidity" is a bit of an ambiguous term...What kind of music do you listen to and do you currently have some subwoofer? If you do, try some of these tracks from different genres that favors a specific sub or not (when level matched).
Anything with some upright bass (whatever) like this track below, you may be happier with a F12G Greentea peng - stuck in the middle
Yaeji - Drink i'm sipping on, Favors F18
Massive Attack: Dissolved Girl - Favors F18
Amaarae - Fancy, Favors F18
MC Ren - Mad Scientist, Favors F18
Composer, Hildur Guðnadóttir Favors the F12G, if you have a couple of them
Composer: Johann Johannson , favors F18
Composer: Hans Zimmer, favors F12G
Thys - Charlatan, favors the F12G
Tuff London - 25 cents, a tie possibly, the 2 subs do something different (perceptually) on this track
Composer: Ludwig Goransson, favors F18
and so on...... (My opinion, of course....your opinion may differ) |