stereo5,
Thank you for that info. I appreciate it.
There was a review in 2015 in Absolute Sound that really praised the speakers but not much since then.
ozzy
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Thanks lancelock
Could you describe the sound a little more? Was the soundstage tilted up or too thin sounding?
ozzy |
Koestner,
Interesting I wish I could hear them. Thanks.
ozzy |
david_ten,
Thanks I'll check out that video.
ozzy
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bmwzm8,
You know that's a good idea. Perhaps I will do that.
ozzy
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parkhurst,
Thank you for sharing that visit.
Did you think the soundstage was set too high as some others have posted on other forums?
ozzy
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fmalitz,
Thank you for your comments.
czarivey,
I'm not sure I follow your comments.
ozzy
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chililine, nooshinjohn, bondmanp,
Thank you for your comments. I did see one negative thread on another Forum saying that the Carvers image was at/near the ceiling. That's hard to believe, can anyone comment as to image height?
ozzy
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contuzzi, aalinik, arsh,
Thank you all for the comments.
I would be sitting about 9 feet away, however, I could go back 3 feet more if necessary.
By the way, I did find a gent on eBay that reconditions the older Carver speakers.
ozzy
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Correction: I will be sitting 12 feet away and could extend that 3 feet more if necessary.
ozzy
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Not at this time, too many thing's going on right now.
ozzy
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Parkhurst,
Its a DIY of my own design, you can see them on my systems page.
Basically they contain the Arum Cantus G-1 Ribbon tweeter and a 7" ScanSpeak Revelator in a purchased high gloss highly braced sealed enclosure.
I created an external crossover box. In it I used top of the line Mundorf SGO classic caps, Jensen inductors and Path Audio resistors. The speakers are wired internally with Cerious Technologies wire.
I am also bi-amping at 80hz to (2) JL Audio F-113 subs.
They sound really good.
ozzy
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Well the delivery date changed and now I hope to get them tomorrow.
ozzy
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chililine, contuzzi,
Or anyone, can you please tell me the exact height of the Carver line source speakers from floor to the top?
I have perhaps 91 1/2" from floor to ceiling.
ozzy
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lpretiring,
Thanks that is the amount it says on their website also under the specifications.
But Jordon from Carver says that is incorrect and they are more like 91 1/2" tall. Actually the review in Absolute Sound lists them as 92" tall.
With these dimensions it will be very tight with my ceiling.
ozzy
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lpretiring,
Well, I went ahead an ordered them.
1. My plan is.. to assemble them in a room that has 96+" in height. Then carry them into my audioroon horizontally.
In the center of my audioroom the ceiling is actually 92 1/2" tall. (Although the final placement will be in an area that is 91 1/2"+ tall. And I must add that it is very difficult to get an exact measurement of the height of the ceiling with a tape measure).
2. Lift them up at the 92 1/2" area and then slide them into the 91 1/2" area.
Bob Carver thinks that will work, Jordan from Carver is not sure.
So I would appreciate it if someone can measures their speakers and/or verify that my plan will work.
Thanks,
ozzy
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Yeah I am a little bedazzled too. The web site says 89" tall but I think that is without the base. It looks like there has been several iterations of base design.
I think (I hope) that they will fit within my dimensions.
Oh but his amps are so good. So I hope there is system synergy in the speakers.
I personally think the man is a innovative genius and I really admire that. However, todays Carver Corporation is down to a few people. Each unit is built one at a time per order.
ozzy
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stereo5,
Well they probably won't be shipped until next week. So maybe a couple of weeks before I get them.
ozzy
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stereo5,
Thanks , I hope so too.
koestner,
No, I sorta got a demo pair that someone cancelled on. So I jumped at the chance. Normally they take a while to get
So, blind faith is all I got.
ozzy
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koestner,
Carver say’s the Rosa Sub is no longer available. And it could be months before they decide on a replacement. Since I already own 2- JL Audio F-113 subs I can use those before they get the sub sorted out and with my DEQX preamp I can blend them with the mains quite nicely.
Boy am I trusting...
ozzy
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koestner,
Well when you visit Michigan look me up.
contuzzi,
I think so too.
ozzy
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tweak1,
Thanks.
Some of the speakers I have owned are Von Schweikert, Eggleston Andra 2's and Legacy Focus. My present DIY versions are better than them all.
I considered many other types but I too like the small footprint of the Carvers.
And, since I already own the Carver Raven 350's I am assuming they should play well together.
I hope they are shipped Monday...
ozzy
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analogluvr,
Thanks. I think so too. Bob Carver to me is a creative genius who thinks and designs outside the norm. I really like that.
erik_squires,
Yes, DIY speakers have many possibilities. (You can see my finished version in my systems page). The only thing that I was unsure of was my ability to make quality looking cabinets. But I found at Parts Express some fantastic black gloss cabinets about the right size that I needed. However, I don’t think they offer them anymore.
I actually thought of trying to make a line source speaker too, but Bob Carver’s long traveled experience made me go the easy route. (Although much more expensive).
ozzy
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oh boy, now I am really interested.
ozzy
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Everybody my Carver speakers have been shipped!
Yayyyyyy!
I feel like a kid now waiting for them.
ozzy
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stereo5,
Well the tracking so far looks to be this Friday.
ozzy
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dracule1,
Thanks for the pointers.
I am not sure if I use the 8 or 4ohm tap. Right now I have it on the 8ohm.
What can I expect if I try the 4ohm tap?
ozzy
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Tomorrow, I'll be sitting in a lawn chair waiting for the truck.
ozzy
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Well no delivery today and R&L carriers has no clue when it will be delivered. They keep saying maybe tomorrow. I hope it's not lost or damaged.
I know in most cases we do not have control of the shipping carrier but if you can avoid R&L please do. Terrible customer service.
ozzy
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dracule1,
I will be using the new Carver Raven 350 amps. My room is 17x25 with nearly 8 foot high ceilings. I have right now ASC tubes traps in the corners and ASC panels on the walls. I'm also using the Synergistic Research HFT's.
Any special advise about speaker placement would be appreciated.
ozzy
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koestner,
Thanks I’m sure your right, saving money over customer service. Poor combo.
I just hate all the lying. Depending upon who you talk to the story changes. The tracking info on their site no longer shows any movement since last Friday stating they arrived at the destination terminal. Today, I was told the tracking is incorrect and that they just received them at the destination terminal today. (Even though their tracking site shows received at destination site last Friday)
I just hope they haven’t been damaged and they are trying to deceive me.
So, I don’t really know where they are or when I will receive them. All I know is if I have a choice in the future I will not use R&L carriers.
ozzy
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The lady at the Detroit R&L terminal was EXTREMLY RUDE! I filed a complaint about her attitude. There is no reason for that... ok, enough said about that.
But, I did receive the speakers today! ...Yippe- Kiyaa!
They were not difficult to set up and also not as tall as I thought they would be. So no problem at all with my 92" ceilings.
But I can tell that I need to play around with placement and it’s various settings. I am also surprised how much bass the speakers have by themselves. Almost no need for subwoofers. I’ll need to calibrate my subs better.
Also, I’m assuming that the speakers will need about a month of breakin.
ozzy
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Stereo5, dracule1,
Thank you I'll use the 8 ohm tap.
I do notice that the meter on the Raven 350 really bounces a lot now.
Since I don't have the Carver Rosa subs and I am using (2) JL Audio F-113's subs (with my DEQX Preamp with its built in electronic crossover) any suggestion as to the crossover points?
ozzy
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musicmann1,
Out of the box they did not sound too good. The treble was peaked and the mid/bass sounded kind of hollow.
I now have about 30 hours of playing time on them and they have improved sonically.
So, I'm thinking with all the drivers, caps wire etc. they will need about 100+ hours of playing time to really evaluate.
ozzy
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Thank you guys for the break in time information.
I have always believed in break in time being so important. I have found that to be true with cables and electronics.
Jordon from Carver said that break in is a myth and does not apply to the Carver speakers. And he said that he has tested many items and has not found any evidence that break in occurs. He said we eventually get used to the sound, our brains break in to the new sound.
But he is only 25 years old and in my opinion is spreading bad outdated information.
Just because we can’t measure breakin doesn’t mean it occurs. Perhaps we don’t have equipment that can measure it, but our ears and brains can detect it. I trust more in the opinions of us old (around the block a few times) audio gurus than the flat earth group.
And... the speakers are improving with more hours on them.
ozzy
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Thank you david_ten
koestner,
I totally agree with you.
ozzy
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dracule1,
I agree.
I was surprised by the Carver employee taking such a hard line on the subject. Even Bob does not believe wire or caps break in but he feels speakers do.
But I sure do...
ozzy
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soix,
Thanks for your comments. Each speaker has 13 tweeters, one supertweeter and 18 midwoofers. So there is a lot of piston area to break in.
Each day after I have run the Purist break in disc for hours I find that the speakers are getting better and better. The tweeters still seem a little hot but much less than the day before etc. But, I have the tweeter, midrange and bass controls set for maximum during the break in process.
ozzy
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Latest Update on the Carver ALS Speakers. I now have about 100 hours of playing time on the Carver ALS speakers. To my displeasure they initially exhibited upper treble brightness and a low output level. The upper treble I thought would clear up with more break in time. But the low output concerned me. I tried everything including moving these tall heavy monsters back and forth in the room for optimum room placement. I had to crank the Ravens nearly to the max to get anything close to my usual high-level setting that I sometimes used with my previous DIY speaker. And, the Carver amp meter was pegging and it blew 4 fuses! (Luckily, I had the forethought to remove my SR blue fuses until everything settles). I thought to myself surely these speakers could not be this inefficient! I was very disappointed. But, Bob Carver said that he would refund my money if I was not satisfied. So that was reassuring. I wanted to give them a fair shot,these speakers have been demonstrated many times in large rooms with 30-60 people and the 2015 Audiophile review talks about running these speakers with Carver’s 20-watt tube amps, then why was I getting such a low output with an amp that can output 350 watts? Were they defective? It drove me crazy… Well, I had an epiphany yesterday morning and remembered that the DEQX manual said something about internal jumpers to increase/decrease the output. So, I took the DEQX apart thinking that a change in the jumper settings may increase the output. Once inside I discovered that the DEQX preamp had some internal output jumpers that were in the wrong place! Instead of being 6 installed in the output jumper spaces there were only 4 and the other 2 were put in the RCA input section. Leaving the output without 2 key jumpers. I will add that I bought this unit used from the Music Room. The previous owner must have moved the jumpers. It turns out this is also why I had hiss with the Carver amps when I initially turned them on using the balanced outputs from the DEQX with my previous DIY speakers. I thought the hiss was because the Carver amps were not a true balanced design. Using the single ended (RCA) DEQX outputs to the Carver Amps removed the hiss and I thought solved the problem, but I really didn’t understand why. Now I do, there were jumpers missing in the DEQX output section! Funny though, the DEQX jumper situation didn’t really surface until I got the Carver speakers. So full circle as the saga goes and once the jumpers were installed in the appropriate positions everything that once sounded like crap now became interesting, exciting and emotional! I am now very pleased with the sound of the Carver speakers. Whew! ozzy
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stereo5, koestner,
Thank you.
Sometimes the obvious is not always the best path to follow.
ozzy
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almarg,
Thank you for your comments.
So are you saying you have 8 jumpers?
The circuit board on my Premate identifies it as a HDP-4.
And there is 6 jumpers. 2 each for the high, mid, and bass. The jumpers were originally only on the mid and bass outputs. There was none on the high outputs and 2 were used on the RCA input section.
Perhaps the 2 on the mid is not supposed to be used on the Premate version but I don’t really know.
The instructions shows all 6 on the outputs. But, it also shows using 2 on the RCA input section. I have a total of 6 of the jumpers to use.
On the RCA input section I now have nothing there, but I am only using balanced inputs.
ozzy
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david_ten,
Thanks.
Yeah, while I was going crazy, Bob was always available. He also was quite stumped by the problem.
In a few days I will reintroduce the SR blue fuses to the amps.
I also had 5 SR HFT's on each of my DIY speakers. With the Carvers, I'm not sure where to start. I called Synergistic and they said "when I find proper placements to let them know!"
Anyone have any suggestions?
ozzy
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almarg,
Thanks but no the high- output needs the jumpers in place. Without them the DEQX unit will output considerable hiss through the balanced outputs. But, perhaps the mid jumpers are not needed with my model.
I sent a email to DEQX on Sunday asking for advise. I hope they answer.
ozzy
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BTW, DEQX is sending me some more jumpers.
ozzy
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almarg,
Inside my DEQX Premate unit the jumpers are labeled as; R bass, L bass, R mid, L mid, R high, L high.
On the back of the unit the outputs are labeled as you say which also corresponds to the DEQX home screen.
Confusing? So is the manual...
All I can say is with the output jumpers on all 3 output sections the balanced out plays dead quite. Removing the high jumpers introduces very high hiss with the balanced out.
ozzy
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dracule1,
Bob was a big reason I went with the amps and speakers. Creative genius.
ozzy
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Al,
Do you have 8 jumpers?
ozzy
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Parkhurst,
Thank you for your question.
The Carver ALS has been an adventure. Between ordering, shipping problems, lack of sub etc. Then there is the speaker placement requirements. I wasn't prepared to be moving the speakers so much. (I have a rotator cuff injury).
My previous DIY speakers and external crossover are really very good and I am still using them with my home theater equipment and I would not hesitate to put them in as full time if needed. They far exceed anything I listened to prior to the Carvers.
Yes, it all seems to be worth it, the sound quality today is very pleasing.
The couple things that I'm not sure of is where to place the Synergistic HFT's that I used with the other speakers and if side wall room treatment is still needed.
ozzy
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I just noticed a pair for sale on Audiogon for a very reasonable price.
ozzy
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