Jwm 12-25-2017
I’m using cat 6 from my pc to the router which acts as a local network as it is not attached to the internet. Cat 6 then goes from the router to the internal M5 board of the bricasti. Which then converts and reclocks the signal via I2S to the chip. I call the router wireless because it allows me to use j river off the pc by j remote to my I pad.
OK. So then the network switch suggestion is applicable. And I see no reason why inserting it into the wired path between the router and the DAC would have any impact on what you presently do wirelessly, or on anything else other than possibly providing a sonic benefit. Fsmithjack 12-26-2017
It’s not about cleaning the signal it’s about sending one less dirty.
it is not less dirty because it was cleaned more but a bit cleaner to start with hence has a lower noise floor. Kind of like 2 clean cars. One was dirty and washed and the other never really got dirty but both are clean. This is a good analogy. As I said earlier, the signal that would be sent by the switch to the DAC is generated by the switch, and while it would have the same data content as the signal sent by the router, the waveform and noise characteristics of the signals sent by the two devices will differ. BTW, the GS108 switch that was suggested comes in both "managed" and "unmanaged" versions. As Joe indicated earlier, IMO the less complex and less expensive unmanaged version would be the way to go. Also, that device provides 8 ports, and you only need two, so I would suggest the 5 port GS105 rather than the GS108. You would simply connect it and its power supply (or an upgraded power supply), and be good to go. Regards, -- Al |
Jwm - your questions are all logical and good questions. I’ve found that we find some things effect the sound of the final product one way or another and quite homestly we don’t really understand or know exactly why other than listening to it.
There is just no way technically a power cable should have the great effect on the sound the way it does. All I can tell you is what I do? I plug one in and listen and then plug another one in and listen and if one sounds substantially better then I trust my ears and go with that one and I’m happy for the improvement.
Many people today will honestly argue tooth and nail as they know for a fact, a scientific fact with all kinds of meansurements and research facts that prove that Speaker Cables and Interconnects or Power Cables are a total scam and we Audiophiles are the biggest idiots in the word and we are all being played as all cables are pure snake oil.
I don’t know about all their documents and scientific proof I just know they have a profound impact on the sound of my system that I am really glad to have.
Sure I wish they cost less but that goes for all of the stuff in high end Audio but that is why it’s called the High End I guess.
When I come across a great improvement and I think others might benefit from my experience then I share it but I understand not everyone will want to do it or understand it or even believe it.
In your situation where you use your WiFi Router over a local network to afford you the use of the excellent JRiver JRmote, that’s a good idea. I use JRiver and JRemote also.
Good idea using a LAN and a switch will work fine in a LAN. You are using internet just a local one over your own homes network I think they call that the intranet, but not sure. A switch will work here.
It’s not about cleaning the signal it’s about sending one less dirty.
it is not less dirty because it was cleaned more but a bit cleaner to start with hence has a lower noise floor. Kind of like 2 clean cars. One was dirty and washed and the other never really got dirty but both are clean.
So much and I mean a ton, or even one could say the vast majority of Hifi Audio is about doing the least damage. It has more to do with taking less away or starting with less damage verse correcting or adding something.
When we hear this great improvement by an Interconnect or Speaker cable or even a Preamp and SQ vastly improves many times we perceive that as a great ad when that improvement comes because that device does less damage or adds less or strips away layers or impediments even though it sounds like it is fixing or adding something.
i can tell your M5 boards and your DAC are incredibly sensitive and high powered SOTA devices that will appreciate the cleanest anything you can feed it. Be it Power Cables or power conditioning or interconnects or a stability platform. The M1 is so good and each time I’ve given it something a little better it has the revolving power to appreciate it and thank you for it by reflecting in increased SQ. |
Al I’m using cat 6 from my pc to the router which acts as a local network as it is not attached to the internet. Cat 6 then goes from the router to the internal M5 board of the bricasti. Which then converts and reclocks the signal via I2S to the chip. I call the router wireless because it allows me to use j river off the pc by j remote to my I pad. |
Jwm 12-25-2017
Ethernet out of router into the M5 internal board of the bricasti to reclock and convert via i2s to the dac. Your telling me this switch cleans up the router. I don’t seem to see how this helps as the signal is handled by the M5 in the dac? How does the switch clean the power? I understand how the dac does it. Jeff, thanks for clarifying that your router-to-DAC connection is wireless, which of course makes the suggestion of inserting a switch between them inapplicable unless you decide to try a wired connection. But if you were to try a wired connection, regarding your question please note the following statement in the first of my posts in which I seconded Fsmithjack’s suggestion, and attempted to provide a technical rationale supporting its plausibility: ...RF content of that signal may find its way around the ethernet interface in the DAC and affect DAC circuitry that is further downstream. By "find its way around" I mean "bypassing." My point is that no matter how good a job the DAC does in cleaning up the signal it receives, and no matter how good the design of the DAC may be, signals and noise don’t necessarily just affect or entirely follow only their intended pathway. And the waveform characteristics and the noise characteristics of the signal that enters the DAC will affect how and if RF energy present in that signal may to at least a small degree find its way via unintended pathways to unintended circuit points "downstream" of the ethernet interface and the internal reclocker you referred to. "Unintended pathways" may include things like grounds within the receiving device, parasitic capacitances, power supply circuitry, or even radiation through the air within the component. "Unintended circuit points" may include the D/A circuit itself, resulting in jitter, and/or analog circuit points further downstream in the component, where audible frequencies might be affected by noise that is at RF frequencies via effects such as intermodulation or AM demodulation. As I see it Fsmithjack has made a well-intentioned suggestion of an inexpensive tweak which he and others he has referred to have found to be efficacious. And what I am basically saying is simply that from a technical standpoint it makes sense, IMO. Regards, -- Al |
@jmw I am now confused. My Bricasti has the M5 board built in to it. That is how I’m able to hook it up to the router through wi fi. Ethernet out of pc into local wireless router. Ethernet out of router into the M5 internal board of the bricasti to reclock and convert via i2s to the dac. Can you draw out a flow diagram to help me understand? Here is what I thought you were doing (but your most recent post is throwing me off): PC > Wireless Connection > Router > Wireless Connection > Bricasti M1SE w/ M5 board If it is different, can you type it out? Thanks. |
@fsmithjack Your points, I'm sure, are not falling on deaf ears or closed minds.
Getting the power supplies and the reclockers etc right, as well as with other mods, these devices are delivering. |
Fsmithjack, what I meant to say is the following. Ethernet out of pc into local wireless router. Ethernet out of router into the M5 internal board of the bricasti to reclock and convert via i2s to the dac. Your telling me this switch cleans up the router. I don’t seem to see how this helps as the signal is handled by the M5 in the dac? How does the switch clean the power? I understand how the dac does it. |
Maybe so yes you those extra cables need to be good ones but my opinion is that has very little to do with the actual switch itself verse it acting as a layer of sound block in between those very noisy. Routers and WiFi units. They generate noise and hash and these super sensitive high powered audio devices pick it up especially when done via a direct link from a router with a switch mode power supply verse a quite switch with a linear power supply. It matters you don’t need to believe me but I hope the other Ethernet folks do because it’s legit. Maybe not in all systems but that Ethernet Cable is being plugged directly from a noisy router right into a Bricasti. You don’t think a level of isolation from that noise could be a benefit? This is Audiogon I get that it’s for amp, Preamp and Speaker folk (I’m one of them also) but trust me the guys over at Computer Audiophile are all over this stuff. They are Popping out the cheap and noisy .15 cent integrated regulators in the routers and replacing with premium parts that are much quieter ones. Running them with batteries.
Ethernet today is kind of like where USB was about 3 / 4 years ago when we use to plug USB cables directly from Mac mini’s or PC towers right into our DAC and we improved this sound by buying $1,000 usb cables. Would anyone even think of doing that today?Back then as in just a few years ago it was said they are just data packets and just 1’s and 2’s and so it doesn’t matter. They used to say the same thing about power cables. The run for miles into your house so how is 1m of premium cable going to matter. Well I agree but then you plug them in and say - wow nice! There are always doubters thats just normal human response. Many take the simple safe view and write these things off and it makes sense why one would do that. For me I try to get out in front. Sure not all things are going to work no doubt but trust me when I tell you if you have a decent system and you run Ethernet Audio and you are running Router direct. Put a switch in between and run it via clean power and get the same clear power for your router and you will thank me. They’ve been doing this for close to 2 years it’s nothing new but the Ethernet player from Bricasti is new and the guys jumping on this train deserve a heads up on a nice little cheap Audio tweak that goes a long way. After you do this google isotona and add one of those also. Good stuff. Ive been digging deep into Ethernet because it is going to userp USB, AES, S/PDIF will all be absolete in a coupe years. Ethernet will be everything with a wireless version of course. There are a couple companies developing crystal oven clocks for Ethernet and it will be game overr when they hit the market. Bricasti and PS Audio are positioned perfectly for this. PS Audio has been way out in front with this but they needed the rest of the infrastructure to catch up and it sure it coming hard and quick now. |
Sorry it is redcloud. I upgraded before going into the hospital for surgery. Too much pain killers!
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@rbstehno - The latest release of firmware for the PS Audio DS DAC is Redcloud, is that the version you're referring to as best? Assume so from most of the comments I've seen.
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My interpretation of "managed" is ability to configure each port individually versus "unmanaged" where all are equivalent. But with only 1 component, should make no difference IMHO.
With switch in the chain, you're hearing 2 additional digital cables. Glad it works for you. Happy Listening!
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If your home is wired with a home run built in, meaning each room has its own Ethernet port and all of the terminates at 1 location, then you would plug all of these Ethernet cables into the switch, then run a cable from 1 of the router ports to the switch. The switch is invisible to the network as long as you have everything plugged into the switch (rooms, computers, tv’s, streamers, etc) and the switch is plugged into router. A switch gives each port 1G performance without doing all the noisy network broadcasts that occur if using a hub.
as for the PS DS, have you heard the Huron upgrade? The PS DS keeps getting better every 6 months or so and it’s 1 of the best now. |
Also, I use JRiver 22 with JRemote. Like it better than Roon. Thanks |
Yes but no it is not a splitter. This is a basic but managed gigabyte
switch. The basic part is good. The less going on the better. Less noise. Yes it can perform splitting duties but it’s much different than a splitter even if you use it as a splitter as it works well at that as well.
For me i could hear it immediately but not all systems are going to have the type of resolution to enjoy these small digital augmentations.
That said this is a Bricasti - Directstream thread and a system with either of these DACs with similar like quality other components it’s definitely a worthwhile add.
I have AudioQuest Vodka ethenet Cables and bought the excellent Cardas Clear Ethernet Cable to try and wanted to see if I could hear a difference so I hooked it direct from my router to player and it sounded worse. I was bummed so then I plugged the Vodka in Router direct and it sounded as worse.
Then I plugged the switch back in and ran the Cardas out of my switch to player and was like oh yes very nice and much better. In digital - noise floor matters. Don’t bother if you don’t want to it’s not a must add but I won’t go without it. Check it out over on Chris Conikors website the computer Audiophile it’s where I learned about and they speak of it as a pure must have. Because I was happy with it I bought a fancy much more expensive switch and it didn’t sound any better or worse.
The extra level helps trap a bit of the router noise ground. A managed switch is a much more simplifier device than a wireless router.
Routers and wireless units are noisy.
The managed switch is simple so when you use one and add nice competent 12v linear power supply - I use the Uptone Audio JS-2 Linear Power Supply plugged into my PS Audio P10 with HiDiamond P3 Power Cable and I connect switch to JS-2 with custom Ghent Audio DC power cables (Canare Copper Cable and excellent Oyaide Connectors). I put isonode Sorbane feet under it with EdenSound Solid Brass Vibration weights on top with AudioQuest Vodka and Cardas Clear Ethernet Cables and trust me it matters. You don’t need to go all in like me but switch as a nice add and I’ve found with Digital the more you can push it the better it sounds.
Moreover, I’ve tries multiple expensive Ethernet filters and they take away too much. Just get the simplest and cleanest you can is best in my opinion. The Acoustic Revive Filter and the SoTm filters both sucked out the life. This did the opposite. It became more linear, quicker, cleaner and just nicer. YMMV 👀 |
Have you tried going LAN in off of your router as a comparison? My guess that’s what he’s doing connecting wireless to the router. How else can you connect wireless? What endpoint? The M5 board is Bricasti built-in dCS Network Bridge. |
Have you tried going LAN in off of your router as a comparison? |
My Bricasti has the M5 board built in to it. That is how I’m able to hook it up to the router through wi fi. The M5 board internally reclocks and sends the digital signal through I2S internally to the converter |
@jwm I use a sub router that connects wirelessly to the main router for wired, networked audio in my audio room. In a way, I’m applying both approaches.
If you are happy with the sound quality via your wireless setup, and are not experiencing any dropouts, etc. then stay with it and enjoy your music. If you go wired, it does complicate one’s system, despite the posts to the contrary. But it may also deliver better sound quality, though that isn’t guaranteed with your specific setup. That’s why folks are encouraging you to give it a try.
If I could eliminate the extra router, the switch, the multiple power supplies and DC cabling, and the LAN cabling I’ve chosen, I would and I have strongly considered it. The dCS Network Bridge comes to mind. Since you like Bricasti, perhaps the M5 for you.
I’m happy I came across this thread and your and Charles’ posts on the Bricasti v TotalDAC outcomes. Thanks.
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Netgear GS108 Switch
is basically a splitter similiar to one I use in my office at work. IMHO, will sound different so I guess better to some.
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Makes sense to me. Computer to the router is "wireless".
However router to the DAC is through an ethernet cable. So the switch would be placed between the router and DAC.
Would the switch improve the sound quality? Listening will decide that.
Charles |
Hi Jeff,
What is it that you are saying is "running wireless"?
If you are saying that the computer that is running J-River is wirelessly connected to the router, that would have no relevance to Fsmithjack’s suggestion or to what I have said in regard to his suggestion.
If you are saying that the DAC is connected wirelessly to the router, I was not aware that the DAC provides wireless connectivity.
If the computer is connected wirelessly to the router and the DAC is connected to the router via an Ethernet cable (which I was assuming is the case), then I believe Fsmithjack’s suggestion and my explanations of it do in fact make sense.
And regarding Joe’s comment just above, I would not liken Fsmithjack’s suggestion to daisy-chaining cables or analog components. In this case the network switch would be regenerating the signal, and the benefit it might provide would be more akin to (although not the same as) what a reclocker does.
Regards,
-- Al
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It's like running daisy train of power conditioners, cables, preamps ... yes it will sound different but is it better??
My office has one ethernet port and I have 3
Linux / Windows
desktops without wireless. I use a network switch to hook up all the desktops to the LAN.
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I am running it wireless and if I add the switch I will not be able to access j river. This totally does not make sense |
Network switch is to add ethernet ports to a router. If running wireless or have enough port on router, why bother adding another layer?
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Hi Jeff,
All the switch would do would be to hand off to the DAC data packets it receives from the router that are addressed to the DAC. And vice versa for communications that are sent from the DAC and addressed to whatever source is being used via the router.
In doing so, however, as I mentioned above the waveform and noise characteristics of the signal received by the DAC may be different than they would be without the switch, since that signal would be generated by the switch rather than by the router. Which in turn could make a difference in the DAC’s sonic performance, for better or worse depending on the particular router and the other variables I mentioned. And based on Fsmithjack’s experience, more likely for the better than for the worse.
Regards,
-- Al
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I don’t understand what the switch would do? |
Jeff (Jwm), I could be missing something but I don’t see why Fsmithjack’s suggestion wouldn’t work in your application. Communications between the router and the DAC would occur no differently than they presently do, if a network switch is inserted between them.
However I would expect the benefit that might result, if any, to depend on the particular router and perhaps also on the ethernet cabling that is being used, as well as on the particular switch and DAC. Presumably any sonic difference that might occur would result from differences in the waveform characteristics (e.g., risetimes, falltimes, and distortion) and also the noise content of the signal received by the DAC. Which in turn may affect the degree to which the RF content of that signal may find its way around the ethernet interface in the DAC and affect DAC circuitry that is further downstream.
Seems to me to be a suggestion that is worth trying, and costs very little.
Happy holidays, and best regards,
-- Al
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Not sure if the was mentioned on this tread, but it adds some value to the conversation. I recently contacted Briscati about the M12 unit.
Some feedback about the M12:
"Roon Ready is in the final stages of the process for the M12 and we anticipate its completion soon. I’ve been testing the Roon code myself and it works great. I look forward to hearing from. "
I am considering using such a device as a preamp and DAC. My choices are the Mola Mola Makua, Briscati M12, or the PS Audio DS.
At the moment my feeling is I will get the Luxman c900u preamp to go with the m900u and the new Mola Mola Tamqui DAC (no preamp). I am flipping back and forth about getting a traditional preamp.or a digital one.
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I don’t think I can use the switch. I’m using UPNP/DLNA which allows to send audio to a network along with j remote I can use my I pad and can run j river. I don’t see how this switch would work. |
Jeff,
If you decide to try this product let me know how it works out in your system.
Charles |
perfect - put this switch between it like I noted and you will like it. SBooster is a nice supply. Happy holidays to everyone!!!
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I am using a local wireless router not connected to the internet. I threw out the switching power supply and added the Sbooster regulated power supply.
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Sweet - do you use an Ethernet switch between your router and your Bricasti or hook right from router?
If you or anyone reading this doesn’t use a Ethernet switch I’m going to hook you guys up for cheap money:
Order this on Amazon for $20.00
Netgear GS108 Switch
also order a Breeze Audio 12v Linear Power Supply on eBay for $60 and any decent quality made in China 12v Linear Power Supply on EBay and you will psyched by the upgrade.
if you don’t feel like waiting 2 weeks to get from China then just grab a iFi 12v little power supply for $50 - I have both and like the China Linear Supply better.
Under $100 upgrade that makes your $12,000 DAC Sound much better.
This is a must add for anyone using Ethernet Audio.
Also, while your at it order 2 of the 12v power supplies and power your router also. So two 12v linear power supplies to power your new switch and your current router.
Also, when adding the Netgear switch you will need another Ethernet cable to run from router to switch. A great cheap one is the AudioQuest Forest that is like $30 for a short one. Decent enough and cheap.
Ethernet is the best because the noise crud from the PC is gone but adding a non managed gigabyte Ethernet switch helps and then getting clean power to run it helps a bit more and removing the switching mode power supply that powers your current router add more and the combo is a nice little tweak. Anyone with Ethernet Audio can get a nice little bump from these little tweaks :) |
I’m using a PC with J river. Ethernet cable is cat7 by Purist Audio. |
@jwm
I have the Bricasti SE with the new internal ethernet capable board. It takes the DAC to a new level.
What server are you using with ethernet? |
I had the opportunity to hear the Bricasti SE and Total DAC d1 6 comparision in Jeff’s (JWM) system. I did not personally find the performance gap as wide as Jeff describes between the two highly regarded DACs. I am in agreement with the Bricasti SE being the better overall sounding and frankly not bettered by the Total DAC in any individual parameter.
The Total DAC sounds quite good to me but when compared directly to the Bricasti it falls a bit short. Surprising to me was the Bricasti is the more engaging and organic of the two. Given all that’s been written and said about the intrinsic "analogue" like character of R2R topology I thought the Total DAC would prove superior in this particular aspect. Listening proved otherwise. I will acknowledge that this was via ethernet where this DAC sounds better than USB at least in my opinion.
I’ve heard numerous R2R type Dacs over the past few years as well as delta sigma based products. My observation is that either can be implemented successfully and I don’t find R2R inherently superior as some others have stated . As Jeff mentioned above, analogue output stage, power supply quality and I/V conversion are of up most importance.
In my opinion too much emphasis can be placed on digital chips and choice of D to A conversion. Bricasti SE certainly demonstrated what delta sigma is capable of when high engineering and implanted standard’s are utilized.
Charles |
I have the Bricasti SE with the new internal ethernet capable board. It takes the DAC to a new level. We are talking about analog like quality and tonality and ease that is fantastic. I bought the Total DAC d1 six with its built in ethernet board to compare. Vincent was real nice and honors a two week money back guarantee. No contest as the Bricasti stomped the Total DAC. The Bricasti throws a much bigger sound stage and is much more musical. The Total DAC is more hi fi sounding. The Total DAC did not better the Bricasti in any way. I was actually surprised at this because of all the positive reviews. I have heard other dac's with discrete resistors used as the conversion and was not impressed. Yes a chip beats the resistor. Power supply and analog stage is was important as far as I'm concerned. I did like the sound of the 110,000.00 discrete MSB dac but never heard it in my system. I don't even know if I would like it better than what I'm using. I still would not spend that much money even if it were half price; way too much for digital.
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Just thinking out loud...Would be interesting how the Bricasti M1SE with
Ethernet option and used as a renderer/i2s DAC would stack up in your
system. This could eliminate your Musica Pristina A Capella and HDMI
cable completely!
and both using
Ethernet option. According to friends,
DirectStream
sounds best with Bridge II. Rumor bridge III in the works.
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Aolmrd1241,
Thank you for your reply, well that’s quite an endorsement of the DMP relative to the PWT. What has kept me happy with the PWT all these years is its ability to present music in such a natural manner. In conjunction with my Yamamoto DAC it avoids a mechanical or electronic character.
Charles |
Hello rdoc -
Just thinking out loud...Would be interesting how the Bricasti M1SE with Ethernet option and used as a renderer/i2s DAC would stack up in your system. This could eliminate your Musica Pristina A Capella and HDMI cable completely!
Mike
Audio Archon - Bricasti dealer
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charles1dad... So it seems that you find the PS Audio DMP a further advancement of the terrific PWT? Hello Charles. Yes I do. I think for me, the DMP [with a great recording] can make the musical fabric of that recording to become much more realistic in nature. The soundscape has much more focus... meaning the DMP is able to let the air,natural details, and tones do a better job of pulling off the illusion of live sound as opposed to canned. To my ears, the whole presentation of the music is much more natural/organic sounding with a sense of timing almost like a live performance,music just seems to gel much,much better. Needless to say, I feel the DMP is a huge step up in my system... |
I'm also a happy user of the PS Audio PWT for many years, using it to play redbook CDs as well as high res PCM files up to 24/192 burned to DVD-R. However everything I've read from users who have tried the newer DMP is that it's a significant step forward in performance in addition to being able to play SACDs when paired with the matching DS DAC.
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aolmrd1241,
I’ve used the PWT the past 7 years and it has been simply excellent playing CDs through my Yamamoto YDA-1 DAC. So it seems that you find the PS Audio DMP a further advancement of the terrific PWT?
Charles |
rdoc... If you still spin cd/sacd the DMP is just the ticket in an over the top listening experience. I was a bit hesitant to give up my PWT for the DMP, seeing the PWT was a fantastic transport to begin with. The DMP/ DS dac, together now with Redcloud installed, make for one hell of a music making machine. A 'peanut butter and jelly' combo..if there ever was one !!!
Redbook sounds almost as good as high res.. and sacd..now without handshake restrictions from Sony...make sacd sound better than one could imagine. Great time to be a audiophile...
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fsmithjack , I sold my Bricasti M1SE when I bought my DirectStream. One of the major reasons was that my server is the superlative Musica Pristina Acappella which not only has a usb, but an I2S output. The I2S output via hdmi cable is a huge upgrade over usb. The DS accepts I2S via hdmi and is vastly superior to the Bricasti via usb. There is just no comparison in my system. The Redcloud OS makes the difference even greater between these 2 dacs in MHO. |
fsmithjack... In a word...Superb !!! This dac now ’delivers’ the goods. The last OS, Huron, was a very,very fine listening experience that to me,was a great all around musically performing update.So when I heard Ted was working on Redcloud I thought...I hope he doesn’t make for a less enjoyable sound than Huron because Huron was really that good,a keeper.. if you will. Well,long story short...Ted hit this one out of the park, and I can honestly say this DS dac now officially has put on the ’big boy pants’ and can compete with dacs way,way above its price point... I can’t seem to turn my system off now with Redcloud at center stage.That in.. and of itself..speaks volumes of how good this dac really is now. Just awesome!!! |
How is it? Has anyone tried it yet? |
New OS firmware update for DS dac called Redcloud to be released on 12/8/17. Supposedly its killer... |
I can wait to get this new - built in Bricasti network player - hey PS Audio guys
There must be a bunch of new owners out there no??
That PS Audio Black Friday sale was pretty awesome !!!
I recently switched speakers and now run Magico S5 Speakers which I love and was looking to set up the ideal amplification match for them.
I came very close to pulling the trigger on the BHK 300 Signature Mono's and BHK Signature pre
I ended up in stead with : Hegel H30 stereo amp with Mark Levinson No.326s preamp but it was close. Almost went all in with PS Audio.
Well I am never changing my Bricasti M1 SE DAC but I did pull the trigger on a brand new PS Audio P10 Conditioner which I love. Such a nice add.
Would be curious any of you guys bought some new PS Audio gear during the big sale. I am a fan of the brand and owned many of their products. It was a very strong sale they ran. Pretty impressive so was wondering if any of you guys got some new great gear?
Thanks |
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