@adamay, I cannot verbalize the differences in pieces of equipment like many here, especially since my usage of these two Ganfet's is in different rooms, with different sources, DAC's and speakers. Also, my expectations in these rooms is not the same. I will say that I think if cost is not an issue, then go with the Atma-Spheres, but if it is, you won't be disappointed with the Laiv's. When I get a second Laiv Chorus Ganfet, I will try to use them in the same system as the Atma-Sphere's, and then offer some thoughts.
Expanding the Class D Conversation: How Would You Characterize Their Differences?
Expanding the Class D Conversation: How Would You Characterize Their Differences?
I'm currently trialing the NAD M23 (1st gen. Eigentakt-based), and I find it intriguing enough to want to understand it better — which means understanding the broader sonic landscape of class D. So I'm crowd-sourcing.
In a recent exchange, the estimable Ralph Karsten (Atma-Sphere Music Systems) made two comments that stopped me cold. For those who missed it, here's what he said:
"IME, class D amps vary in sound more than tube amps, which is to say, quite a lot."
"IMO there is a bigger difference between various class D amps than you hear between various tube amps. IOW just because you heard one class D amp says nothing about how the next one might sound."
Link: https://forum.audiogon.com/posts/2885828
As I think through this more carefully, these are genuinely important claims. My own experience with tube amps confirms that they produce audibly distinct characters across topologies and designs. If Ralph is right and class D exceeds that range, then generalizing from one class D experience to another is even more hazardous than I assumed.
One specific question for Audiogon members:
If you have a Class D amp or have compared class D amplifiers, how would you describe their character(s)?
Here are some criteria I use:
- Frequency balance — Is the tonal response even across bass, mids, and treble, or does it favor certain regions?
- High-frequency texture — Are the highs extended and smooth, or edgy, grainy, and fatiguing?
- Bass definition — Is the low end tight and articulate, or loose and bloated?
- Midrange character — Does the midrange feel present and natural, or recessed and thin?
- Transient speed — Does the amp respond quickly to dynamic attacks, or does it sound sluggish and rounded?
- Dynamic range — Does it scale convincingly from quiet passages to loud ones, or compress the difference?
- Soundstage width and depth — Does it create a convincing three-dimensional image, or sound flat and narrow?
- Image specificity — Are instruments and voices placed precisely, or do they blur and wander?
- Background noise floor — Is the silence between notes actually silent, or is there grain, haze, or hash?
- Long-term listenability — After an extended session, do you want to keep listening, or has something been quietly fatiguing you?
If you can include relevant system context — room, speakers, preamp — please do. Those variables will help me interpret what the amp itself is contributing.
I'm less interested in rankings than in understanding what Ralph mentioned, namely the [vast] range of sonic signatures class D is capable of. Eigentakt, Hypex, Pascal, Purifi, GaN-based, etc. — all fair game.
Price is no constraint here — I'm interested in the full range of what's out there.
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@hilde45 - he's explained many times that he only reviews products he really likes a lot, so yeah, he raves about everything; doesn't mean he's a 'charlatan'. But if you don't listen to him, you might not have heard him explain that. I really don't know what contact with the Dead has to do with anything, unless Jerry Garcia is involved. He's not hurting anybody with his beliefs and he's not forcing anybody to pay him anything. @bartsw + 1 The whole point of most religions, it seems to me, is the afterlife, and them telling you what happens there and what to do here to get where you want to go after you croak. I think most of them would say 'the soul never dies'. Personally, I'm still waiting to see their vacation photos of it.. |
As stated above by @larsman, my experience with Class D (Acoustic Imagery Atsahs using Putzeys’ NC1200 amps), is similar, leaving me a bit scarred for the topology. I have owned many other Class A and AB amps (such as Clayton M300, Lamm 1.2 Ref, Cary MB500, and my current SMc Audio DNA-1 ULTRA G20 monoblocks) and while I liked some of them more than others, all of the Class A or AB amps were better at portraying the illusion of real music than the Class D Atsahs. In addition to flattening out the soundstage, to my ears the Class D amps seemed to subdue spatial information resulting in the perception of individual musicians each playing in a sound booth, rather than a coherent performance by an entire band or orchestra. I seemed to perceive an abbreviated sound envelope in that the attack was represented but the decay, sustain, and release were unnaturally attenuated. However, I admittedly have no experience with the newer Class D amplifiers, such as those using GaN FET or Purifi technology, or Bruno Putzeys' newer Class D amplifiers using Trajectum technology. |
@larsman If you found out that your doctor also had a website promising to communicate with the dead for money, would that affect your confidence in their opinions about scientific matters? For me, it would. I think the analogy with audio is imperfect, but since audio is a hobby with a complicated scientific and engineering aspect, it tracks for me. I also like qualified, educated, and competent people in government, so maybe I'm biased. |
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