User feedback on subs

@mgrif104 

Well it's definitely not moving....and speaking of moving it took 3 movers to get it in place despite the fact that it came in a rolling flight case.

@mgrif104  I believe the three brands you're considering are all manufacture rated @-6dB. Subjectively marketed as subwoofers this "safe" amount of roll off is dramatic enough so as not to excite a rooms standing wave bass modes at the expense of the delicately worthwhile body found on many extra low frequency recordings.

The upsides to these sub-bass woofers is fare less, if any critical room placement being beneficial allowing for ergonomically convenient room location and the simplicity of system integration needing only gain and phase adjustments to taste. So you should be good to go. Enjoy.

Just circling back on this. I received the REL #31s two days ago but needed some help getting the (very big!) boxes up to my 2nd floor. I now have them in the system and have been working on setup while they run in.

First  - a shoutout to @deep_333  Turns out your model was pretty darn close. The suck out was centered around 40 hz just like you modeled Your suggestions were helpful - thank you. 

The room is certainly challenging. I need support at 40, but not at 50 and up, and not at 25-30 as my speakers are fully there in that range. But they also need help below 23hz.

Initial reactions are pretty good, but I have work to do. I think I can get there as the #31s have some parametric filters built in. And, the remotes they come with are really helpful to be able to dial things from my chair. More later.

Best,

This is for those of you who asked me to report back.

After moving them too many times, I’ve settled on the placement of the Il Cremonese main speakers and am quite happy with the results. I still have a suck out at 40 hz as @deep_333 indicated I would. However, I have reasonably addressed that with the addition of the #31s set well outboard of the mains while still being in relative time/phase alignment with them. Yes, 40 is still down, but it’s a narrow band and I’m otherwise relatively flat from 18hz up to the limits of my hearing.

I have the subs crossed over at 45 hz and while I might yet try more adjustment - including the parametric eq available on the subs, I’m loving the results. The subs are acoustically invisible unless you turn them off. The sense of space/ambiance and effortlessness are quite extraordinary. Impact is there when I play something with hard hitting bass transients.

At times I’m listening to music significantly louder than I’m able to on my other system because there is no audible distortion from this room. While I do intend to add some room treatments now that I’ve settled the other elements, it is already wonderfully smooth and musical to my ears.

The sense of scale is better than expected considering I’m sitting 8’ from the mains though it certainly falls short of some large systems in large rooms. Nevertheless, on well recorded music, it’s difficult to localize the speakers as the soundstage is far wider than the width of the speakers. The subs, acoustically speaking, pulled the main speakers farther apart.

I listened to a demo of a REL six pack at AXPONA. It was a compelling demo clearly demonstrating the efficacy of stacking units to bring bass production higher off the floor. But, my wallet has no appetite for another 4 of these subs. However, because the mains are largish, I’m still getting vertical scale in my presentation. Could it be better? I’m sure. But I’m not feeling like I am experiencing many limitations here now. (My wife was happy to hear that).

It seems cliche to say I’m hearing things in the music I’d never heard before, but it’s true nonetheless. I feel like I’m now escaping more into the music and listening less to my gear. 

I’m not naive enough (or dishonest with myself) to believe I’m done with system changes, but I’ve never before experienced this level of musical engagement.

I recognize how fortunate I and many of us are to be able to reproduce music so beautifully. Though I’ve already been through it today, back to the Koln concert for me now.

Best,

@mgrif104 My room is pretty small about 750 cu.ft. about almost a true cube. Almost the worst listening space to have. Fortunately, the room node is always have issue was at around 63hz. Any speaker I manage in that room in that particular position I will always have a node at that frequency regardless what I use. Since this was at the higher scale of the spectrum,  it was usually caused by the the speakers and not the sub. One of the solutions to improvise the issue was to high pass the speakers at a higher frequency around 70hz with a steeper slope (probably a 12db/oct). Many subs are fixed slope and speakers are naturally sloped. The only two I know that have variable slope are DSP controlled SVS subs and probably JL.