Using PA Speakers In A Home "Audiophile" Application!

I haven’t read the entire thread, so this might have already been mentioned.

But if one cares at all about imaging and soundstage, then pa speakers should be avoided.

I have heard dozens of pa speakers at many different price points in home systems, driven by good quality amps, and have never heard a wide, deep soundstage, with good layering, nor precise placement of musicians within it.

They all tend to project the music out into the listening space, and reproduce it in a very flat (not talking about frequency response).

Update:

- Ordered the speakers

- Buddy of mine is shipping me an old Accuphase analog active crossover unit...will try my luck with that.

@simonmoon

I have heard dozens of pa speakers at many different price points in home systems, driven by good quality amps, and have never heard a wide, deep soundstage, with good layering, nor precise placement of musicians within it.

The culprit is largely PA electronics, imo. For example, I’ve tried Crown amps on my hifi rig and the soundstage flattening is immediate. I have also observed it when trying out Mcintosh hifi amps (not meaning to offend any Mcintosh users)...the flat wall of sound with no depth, layering and nuance. Denafrips dac --> Luxman, Schiit, Yamaha hifi amps, etc should remedy that situation...is my theory for now/will know an answer in the next month.

"advanced beamforming"   What is that?

simonmoon:

If you are ever in Southern California, you need to come to my house and hear what PA components set in the right cabinets can do for imaging and soundstage, clarity, and precision of instrument and vocal placement.

Some of the "PA" components are/were of extremely high quality and placed in the right cabinets, driven by the right electronics, can do just as well as the high priced spread of today.

For example, take the 18" and 9.5" JBLs I used in the Mermans. You really think some Parts Express woofer is the same quality? You really need to step up your game to come close, and I’ve had people say that my speakers can "out-image" systems costing 6 figures. I do use a modified Great Heil AMT over 2.5kHz.

https://jblpro.com/en-US/site_elements/2241h-data-sheet

https://www.hifido.co.jp/sold/21-33777-25059-00.html?KW=&G=&P1=&P2=&A=10&N=&Y=&CT=0&M=0&LNG=E&OD=0&O=2050&L=50&SD1=0&SD2=0&SD3=0

Remember that back in the ’60s, 70s, and 80s, JBL would use many of the same components in their PA systems as they did in their studio monitors used in mix-down of so much of the music that we still love.

@atmasphere wrote:

I’ve run into breakups in older designs (like Altec, with their aluminum diaphragms) and also in newer designs, like the JBL speakers I use for my keyboard setup. If I get over a certain volume, the speaker doesn’t handle it that well (gets harsh) so it does seem like I’m setting off a breakup in the horn.

My speakers at home use beryllium diaphragms; the first breakup is at 35kHz.

That’s not much of a basis for qualified comparison here. Which JBL’s are those, and how are they (or the Altec’s) representative of a whole segment of speakers?

Look, I believe we’ve been here before, but there’s nothing to support the narrative inkling towards modern pro drivers, or even a range of older dittos, being in particular marred by breakup modes. There’s tons of great pro drivers and horns out there with solid R&D behind them, and they don’t suddenly turn harsh when pushed - believe me. If they did they’d be out of business. Of course you could find cheaper "weaklings" among them with sub optimum horn profiles, flimsy material choice, less than stellar drivers and overall execution, and they would be the easy and even convenient target for field coil-, beryllium diaphragm-fitted and lovely hardwood housed speakers like your no doubt great Classic Audio Loudspeakers to make a case against them.

Instead choose someone your own size, as they say; it would be most interesting to put together an all-out combination of partly DIY, off the shelf quality pro driver-fitted horn-based speaker setup at a likely much cheaper price, actively configured with horn subs and all, and then have a showdown for a more fair comparison. I’m not trying to belittle speakers as the ones you own, on the contrary, but if we want to make this a fair fight then let’s have the other party pull out their big guns as well :)