Powered speakers show audiophiles are confused


17 of 23 speakers in my studio and home theater systems are internally powered. My studio system is all Genelec and sounds very accurate. I know the best new concert and studio speakers are internally powered there are great technical reasons to design a speaker and an amp synergistically, this concept is much more important to sound quality than the vibration systems we often buy. How can an audiophile justify a vibration system of any sort with this in mind.

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@phusis , let me change that to I’m overthinking. I have a well treated room that is nicely EQ’ed in my main system which does everything from 2 CH to 9.2.7 Atmos. I just got a new preamp/dac/headphone amp in the Sony Signature line. I can connect it via RCA to my HT processor and use the subs, the EQ, etc. I can also connect it via balanced directly to my active speakers. Too systems, totally different, in one room. Before I start messing with subs and EQ with the new 2 CH pre I want to let it go and see what happens. Paul McGowan disavows EQ in a 2 CH system (but still likes subs).

I got the new Sony Signature TA-Z1HES installed tonight and so far have only used it as a dac connected to my main system (subs, EQ, etc). I connected it to a laptop and streamed some ripped files as well as streamed tidal. I must have a bias to Japanese tuned products because my processor is a Marantz, this new unit is a Sony and my DAP is an Onkyo DP-X1. The dac in the Sony is crystal clear straight out of the box, I look forward to breaking it in. Of the upsampling features I like DSD remastering the best. You can only engage it with files of CD resolution or lower (44hz). The real surprise was when I let my Onkyo DP-X1 DAP upsample and output the files as native DSD. I have the song Angela by Bob James on an SACD and heard it many times. I never thought upsampling could approach native DSD and if I didn’t know it I couldn’t tell the difference. When streaming Tidal I have to let the DAC do the DSD remastering. The DSD choices available are limited, inconvenient, and expensive. What a pleasant surprise and I would say just as a dac this unit justifies the price. I’ll try it as a two channel preamp tomorrow and post. The engineers at Sony know digital.

@phusis , The problem most of us face with subwoofers with normally sized rooms in a residential setting is SIZE. Horn loaded subwoofers would have to be huge to work correctly. Same thing goes for the enclosures required to house a 21" subwoofer. It is much easier and more cosmetically acceptable for most people, myself included, to use multiple smaller drivers is sealed enclosures. With modern drivers you can get a 12" driver into a 1.5 cubic foot sealed enclosure and with enough power and digital signal processing you can get it to do just about anything within the limits of your amplifier to work perfectly. I use 8 of them which equals 4 15" drivers or two 18" drivers. In a 16 foot wide room I have no trouble getting flat down to 18Hz where they are rolled of steeply by a digital high pass filter at 84 dB/oct so as not to waste power and piss of the turntable. They are actually boosted 6 dB or so at 20 Hz to simulate the visceral sensation you get at a live concert at more reasonable levels. They are also in perfect phase and time with the main speakers. This is critical if you cross over at 100 Hz like I do and don't want to know you are listening to subwoofers.

@mijostyn 

I use 8 of them which equals 4 15" drivers or two 18" drivers.

Does the law of diminishing returns kick in after the first 2 or 3 subs?

I fully agree with @mijostyn.

I used to work for a church doing sound that had the biggest electronic organ in the world. There were 4x 30 inch subs in separate cabinets on both the left and right sides of the main sanctuary the cabinets were not facing the same direction. The organ sounded wonderful and could keep up with the biggest real organs in the world. The speakers for the organ were not set up like a concert but looked like someone had randomly designed them, definitely more of an art than science.

My room is wonderful because it's fairly large and is not square or rectangle and doesn't have any flat parallel walls it has a 10 foot ceiling. Just last night I moved my expensive Lyngdorf 60-2 processor to my Dolby Atmos mixing system simply for it's acoustic room fixing system "Room Perfect", until now I didn't have to use any acoustic processing it simply didn't help even with powdered subs built into my main speakers and 6k watt separate subs next to the speakers. I nearly bought very expensive speakers but realized I only need very good high and mid frequencies and the low frequencies if done right will make everything smooth out. Low frequency is an art, ears are the most part of tuning the system, play a 60hz or 80hz tone and roll the phasing where it's most pleasing musically. Don't forget any latency if you have any digital devices you have latency no way around it.

My Atmos system speakers distances are not spec, newer thinking in acoustics is tending toward non symmetrical speaker placement I fully agree. Ultimately a mixing room needs above all to be standard but this room is personal and I want to experiment, a lot. In the future even 2 channel speakers will be object based and won't need to be symmetrically based.