I have read a lot of comments that I find mystifying. I have a system with decent resolution- Cary SLP05 and SST Son of Ampzilla II feeding ATC SCM35 speakers. My experience is that high res streaming from either Quboz or Tidal almost always sounds better than my CDs, with many of my early cds sounding wretched. Almost without exception, cds remastered in the late 1990s sound much better (Rudy van Gelder Blue Note recordings, as an example), as do the high res equivalents. Well recorded cds occasionally sound slightly better than streamed equivalents, though I am suspecting that the SPDIF rca inputs on my Yggdrasil sound better than the USB input. And, high res streaming crushes my vinyl (Ariston RD11s, Grace 707, Benz Ace).
CD Quality Versus Streaming Quality
I realize this will be a contentious subject, and far be it from me to challenge any of the many expert opinions on this forum, but if I may offer my feedback vis-a-vis what I am hearing, and gain some knowledge in the process.
i will begin saying that my digital front end setup is not state of the art, but i have had the good fortune to listen to a number of really high-end systems. I guess the number one deficit in my digital front end is a streamer server, and no question about it that will improve the sound.
My CD player is a universal player; Pioneer BDP-09fd. It uses Wolfson DACs. It has been modified to a degree. I have bought and sold other players, but kept this one, because it has a beautiful sound that serves the music well.
Recently, i ventured over to my son’s place and we hooked up my player (he doesn’t have one and rely’s on streaming only) We compared tracks / albums of CD quality and master quality streamed on Tidal with ‘redbook’ CDs I have. For example, some Lee Ritenaur CDs and some Indian classical and the wonderful Mozart and Chopin.
His system is highly resolving.
we were both very surprised to find the CDs played on the player to be the better sound. And not just by a little. The sound was clearly superior, with higher resolution and definition, spatial ques, much better and clearer imaging. Very surprising indeed. Shouldn’t there be no difference? This would suggest the streaming service is throttling the bandwidth or compressing the signal?
i am most interested to hear others’ observations, and suggestions as to why this might be? I do love the convenience aspect of streaming, but it IS expensive for a chap like me of fairly modest means. The Tidal HiFi topline service is $30 per month I believe, something the good lady is not too thrilled about. God forbid I should suggest Roon on top of that I may likely get my walking papers. I jest, but only partially LoL. My point is, if I pay this sort of money, isn’t it fair to expect sound to equal the digital stream from the CD player and silver disc?
Thoughts?
AK
i will begin saying that my digital front end setup is not state of the art, but i have had the good fortune to listen to a number of really high-end systems. I guess the number one deficit in my digital front end is a streamer server, and no question about it that will improve the sound.
My CD player is a universal player; Pioneer BDP-09fd. It uses Wolfson DACs. It has been modified to a degree. I have bought and sold other players, but kept this one, because it has a beautiful sound that serves the music well.
Recently, i ventured over to my son’s place and we hooked up my player (he doesn’t have one and rely’s on streaming only) We compared tracks / albums of CD quality and master quality streamed on Tidal with ‘redbook’ CDs I have. For example, some Lee Ritenaur CDs and some Indian classical and the wonderful Mozart and Chopin.
His system is highly resolving.
we were both very surprised to find the CDs played on the player to be the better sound. And not just by a little. The sound was clearly superior, with higher resolution and definition, spatial ques, much better and clearer imaging. Very surprising indeed. Shouldn’t there be no difference? This would suggest the streaming service is throttling the bandwidth or compressing the signal?
i am most interested to hear others’ observations, and suggestions as to why this might be? I do love the convenience aspect of streaming, but it IS expensive for a chap like me of fairly modest means. The Tidal HiFi topline service is $30 per month I believe, something the good lady is not too thrilled about. God forbid I should suggest Roon on top of that I may likely get my walking papers. I jest, but only partially LoL. My point is, if I pay this sort of money, isn’t it fair to expect sound to equal the digital stream from the CD player and silver disc?
Thoughts?
AK
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- 239 posts total
@jallan. +1 As a practical matter a well chosen streaming system will equal or outperform a CD system (due to the greater availability of higher resolution files). The difficulty in assembling such a system will become easier in the future. Just as there are differences in implementations and system interactions of it’s components. I suspect the broad range of experiences (each of us with a very limited number of them) leds one to draw different conclusions. I have seriously streamed and been dissatisfied in the output for twenty years or so. Finally I purchased high quality streamer, then traded them until I found the right ones and that difference disappeared. It is difficult to put together a great sounding CD front end… it is equally difficult to put together a great sounding streaming front end. If you put together both. It is easy to have them sound different. There is no fundamental technology difference between CDs and Streaming (other than the location of storage (leaving out the file versions used) like there is in vinyl playback. So while it is difficult to deal with all the variables in real time transmission of data through the internet. A number of companies have taken it seriously, Aurender for instance, and others. In the future this will be the primary mode of digital content unless there is an apocalypse. One of the reasons I think this is an important discussion is that it is far more general than this component or that. So, folks reading these kinds of discussions may set their direction for many years. Time and technology moves rapidly… and heading down a dead end is costly in time and money. |
Bruce Springsteen Born To Run Earliest CD v Qobuz Stream/Download Yes here it is for others to compare, I opened up those two Dynamic Range Data Base comparisons to see the dynamic range details. (WOW! big difference) For those that don’t know. Red (bad) means highly compressed Green (good) means uncompressed and original usually from the master. The first 1982 release CD https://dr.loudness-war.info/album/view/98918 And here is the 2014 compressed (squashed) Qobuz one https://dr.loudness-war.info/album/view/58448 Cheers George |
Yes, if you listen to Classic Rock, then streaming may not be your best choice. Most classic rock recordings I have heard only sound good in my car. Shame. I don’t listen to classic rock on my home rig and find many great Qobuz recordings with the music I listen to. Sometimes Qobuz sounds better than the same CD I have ripped onto my Innuos Zenith 3 server. Qobuz and streaming have been wonderful for me. I am listening to new music all the time because of it. A dream come true really. |
Hi Folks, i hope you are all enjoying a restful Sunday. I must apologize because, my son informed me yesterday morning of a setting that effects sound quality from Tidal streaming and that did call into question the validity of the results of the test we performed. Under settings, there is a loudness normalization option, and this impacts dynamic range. Also my son had used his iPad, which has an option to set quality according to available bandwidth, which was also active. We neglected to check these and they had been selected to active during all our listening, without us knowing. We did some listening tests again. This time the differences in quality were not quite so dramatic, but were apparent all the same. I really need to try the dedicated streamer / server as that may be the answer. The question of EMI / RFI is top of mind too. |
- 239 posts total