CAT SL MKIII vs ARC SP 11 or 10

Howdy,

Let me be a bit of a contrarian here. I have owned (and listed in order of preference) the SP 10, SP 11 and CAT Ultimate. To my ears, the CAT is the most dead piece of equipment I’ve ever heard. That thing was dull, opaque, sterile and lifeless. “Neutral” maybe, but it did not begin to capture the essence of music. I had the SP 11 at the time I bought the CAT and tried for quite a while to convince myself that the CAT was an improvement. Finally, I put the SP 11 back into the system and did a direct comparison. The CAT was listed here on Audiogon the next day.

I bought my SP 10 after that episode and sold off the 11. I lived happily for about a year at which time I began to get interested in digital. Up to this point, I had use primarily analogue sources. The main short coming of the 10 is it’s line stage. It’s not that the line stage is bad, it’s that you have to take the 10 out of by pass mode to access it which in turn puts all of the front panel clap-trap in the circuit. This definitely degrades the sound. Since I had gotten fairly serious about adding a decent digital source, I debated whether or not to send the 10 to Great Northern Sound for modification or to look elsewhere. In the end, I bought the Herron line and phono stages and sold off the 10. I have lived fairly content with these for the last couple of years.

As a footnote, I had a chance to hear a Friends 10 a couple of weeks ago and there is still something very special about that pre-amp. It makes music like none other I’ve heard. It has a liveliness that I’ve not heard elsewhere. It might have something to do with the two 6L6’s in the power supply. I am hopeful that the Aesthetix combo (that I should get to hear in the next couple of weeks ) will combine the best of the 10 and Herrons in one package. This may be my final resting ground for a pre-amp.

Regards,

Scott

I agree with Rcprince, it is a matter of taste with these excellent pre-amps. I have an CAT SL-1 Mk 1, an audio buddy has an SP-10 Mk2. Each have their specific virtues. The 10 has a lovely bloomin midrange with depth that defines the term "musical" it is beguiling but is less extended at either end. The phono stage of this unit is more preferable to me than the CAT or even my current pre-amp for that matter. The CAT is more neutral with better extension. But neutral is a relative term. Compared to the current crop, the old CAT isn't as neutral as many out there.

The SP-11 I haven't listened to for years but it seemed a bit "whiter" sounding and maybe more transparent than the other two. This was my definite impression when compared directly to a 10 in the same system over a relatively extended period. I always liked the 10 better, more romantic and involving, personal choice and a different time. The 10 is a real classic but does require expensive retubing (read good NOS) You need to listen to hear what camp your in or hopefully you can read between the lines and have a better feel for the differences.

Tubegroover,
If you intend to keep the CAT, I strongly urge you to send it back to the factory to get it upgraded to Mk 3 status. You will change your impressions of the CAT for the better! The Mk 1 (I assume you have the Signature Mk 1) uses 12AU7 in the V1, V2, V6, V7 positions, which are the input stages for the phono & line resp. The Mk 3 uses 6922 in those positions. I believe that the latter is much better sounding than the Mk 1 that you have. Also much quieter. The tubes last much longer too. If I remember correctly, the Mk 1 version "ate" tubes.
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I concur that the CAT doesn't have the ARC midrange bloom. However, I FEEL, that this midrange bloom is "beguiling" as Tubegroover put it. It is artificial i.e. not real. Some people prefer their music this way. So be it. So, I agree, you'll have to discover which camp you belong to & accordingly make your choice.

The CAT volume control is a PITA, I agree! 1 click down is too low & 1 click up is too high! However, CAT does offer a volume control called "CD taper" & is designed to be half the volume increment steps than the default factory volume control. I believe that from 6 o'clock to 12 o'clock on the volume control you get volume increase in half the dB increment steps as the default & past 12 o'clock the volume control steps are exactly as the default. FWIW.

Put the CATs Ultimate aside (since I have not heard), I would probably choose ARC SP11 MKII for my setup. There are only 6 tubes (3 for phono and 3 for line stage) in SP11 MKII so the tube cost is relatively cheap.
Depends on match up, the CATS is definitely more opaque than ARC. In my opinion, the CATS is less musical to my ears. However, either one should be a good choice.

These comments are interesting. Years ago some felt the SP 10 was more musically involving than the SP 11, as the SP 11 moved toward more accuracy. Especially in the phono stage, the SP 11 wasn't as bloomy or euphoric. Some of the comments here now are the CAT Ultimate falls flat musically because it isn't as musical as an SP 10. I spent years with an SP 11 and now I've had the CAT Ultimate for a few years. With the CAT it's easier to hear the difference from one recording to the next because it colors the sound less. It exposes more information, good and bad, than the older ARC units rather than wrapping the sound in a euphoric coloration.

Speaking from years of experience Jld1965 should go one of two ways. If the phono stage is all he's going to use he should go with the SP 10 if he's looking for the "golden glow" sound. If the line stage is of material significance, go with the CAT Ultimate or MK 3. The SP11 doesn't have as good a line stage as the CAT and if a euphoric phono stage is what he wants why stop halfway?