bel canto dac 3 cd 2 owners

I see that at least 60 people have looked at this thread, but so far no responce, nobody has any advice ? chris

hi, the power supply is in another box that is the same size and shape of the dac 3, but its filled with caps and ac filters, it converts ac to 12 volts dc, they take out the power supply board in the dac 3 and put in a new 12 volt board. then both the dac 3 and the cd 2 plug into the new separate dedicated power supply. I was told by belcanto that it lowers the noise floor by orders of magnatude, and is quite a sonic upgrade. I have all of my gear pluged into a shunyata hydra 8 [the new one] with good powercords, I live in a 1920s built apartment so a dedicated line is out of the picture. I have done power supply mods to my Rogue audio m150s , and that was a big upgrade in sound, so I am hoping that this would also be a nice upgrade. thaks for the input, chris

oh , I forgot to add, i love the sound of my dac 3, and dont have any intention of replacing it any time soon, but you all know about the upgrade bug, it itches and itches untill you scratch it !! I will upgrade my speakers [revel f32] sometime also ,but the dac 3 cd2 and rogue m150s are staying for a while. thanks , chris

hi, its not that I dont like my system. I do. but, it can always be better ! I have 2 sources pluged into my dac 3, my cd 2, and my playstation, which I turn off when i listen.I have tried five or six digital cables, i like the wireword gold eclipse aes ebu the best so far. I also use the dac three directly into the rogue m150s, at some point i will get a pre amp, because some day i will add a turntable to my system, but for the moment its cd only. I am pretty shure that this [the power supply upgrade] is a case of better sounding, not just different sounding. thats why I am considering this. thanks, chris

2chnlben, I have no intention of hooking a computer to my system, not intill they force us to. I am a collector , I love my collection of cds, and slowly growing lps, The idea of a list of music on a computer just does not do it for me, I like cover art and everthing else that comes with it. when all music is recorded in 24 bit 96k or higher then maybe I will look into something. the bel canto dac 2 is 24 bit 96k, so I will not have to replace it to hear hi rez formats. thanks, chris

also, this is a power supply upgrade for both the cd 2 and the dac 3, not just the dac 3 ! the cd 2 has a wall wart power supply, so Im thinking that this should be a good upgrade, by beefing up both power supplies at the same time . thanks, chris

Just was informed that there is a new upgrade for the power supply in the dac 3.5 . I am not that informed on what the upgrade actually is but I am going to get it and report back on any differences, stay tuned !

I upgraded my bel canto dac 3.5 vbs to the mk 2 status. The wizards at bel canto just keep making an already good product better and better ! great job Bel Canto!

Ok its been about a week now , and i think its sounding even better than when I first got it. it will be interesting to put the belcanto front end up against some more expensive competition !!! chris

thanks for the ideas, I do not think you were puting my gear or anything else for that matter. I would like to know why you think the ps audio dac is better, or league all together, the bel canto was the best measuring dac stereophile has ever tried. i know that measurments dont tell the whole story, but i have put the belcanto up against some very expesive competition , and prefered the belcanto. another thing about me, i like to keep gear for a while, I dont like constantly changing my system. my cd2 and dac 3 are less than two years old, which I consider new. thanks for the input, chris

one more thing, the only time that I have heard apple lossless, was through the wadia ipod dock into the dac three, in direct head to head comparisons the cd2 playing the same cuts that was burned to the I pod , the apple lossless lost badly, it was not even close , the old fashioned transport won hands down. thanks, chris

Thank you , audiogalore, Its nice to see that you have had the same experience with the wadia, most people who read my observations think I’m nuts, but if you heard what I did , you would agree. I have not heard your system , with your equipment however, and I’m not suprised you have found a better way of doing things. At some point in the future I would like to hear a moderately priced music server, a friend has the soloos but it is out of my price range. I would like a way to listen to hi rez formats when more music becomes available that way, but to listen to Redbook I will stick to the transport I already own. Thanks for the tips, Chris

Also, the point of me starting this thread was to see if anybody out there has had any experience with upgrading the power supply of their digital gear , and what differences sonically did it make, not for advice on different gear. I know companies like NAIM have power supply upgrades , Mod companies like Great Northern Sound make their living off of such things, so is it worth it, could it be just different sounding, or truly better ? Thanks for the advice, Chris

Ok, so after talking with bel canto I decided to get the upgrade. They said it would take a little while to break in, but should still sound better than before right away.
They were right. Within the first song i had a smile on my face, this was better sounding, and if it actually gets better, holy crap! Its fantastic sounding so far, i will post more on actual differences once its broken in more. I have a friend who has the same cd2 dac 3 combo, so we can do side by side tests, and will let everyone know how it turns out, thanks , Chris

Rich, this is a new bel canto product, not a mod. Bel canto does not have it on their website yet, but they will. I found out about it after talking with belcanto.
it is called the VBS , and is in its own box, it looks just like a ref1000 with the single blue led on the front, and brushed aluminum face plate . you can power up to three different bel canto products with it, but not the power amps. it converts the 120 v in to 12v out then connects the cd 2 dac three with two well made shielded 12 power cables that have locking connectors on them. the dac three needs a new 12v power board installed as well, but the cd already has 12v power in ,so its plug and play for it. It has so much storage capacity that I can unplug the VBS from the wall , and it still plays music without a hiccup, way cool. I will have more on the sound once I have some more time on it , thanks, Chris

Thanks rich, I understand, there are lots of mod service companies to choose from, some know what they are doing, some don’t. And the dac 3 had a very good power supply, this is just better without question. And for what it costs, it should be, but if you have more than one piece of bel canto gear, such as I do, the cost gets split between the two. Making it more cost effective. So far I am very happy with what it’s doing sonically. Thanks, Chris

Now it’s been a while, the new Bel Canto VBS is nice and broken in. My friend came over for a shootout with his Dac 3 sans power supply upgrade. We set up the gear so we could do quick side by side comparisons between them. A long story short, the new VBS Dac 3 combo is much better than the stock Dac three, and by a substantial margin! Wider soundstage, better detail, more open,
You basically name it, it was better ! Great job Bel Canto , they came out with an upgrade that actually is an upgrade, and not just different sounding. If any one out there has the Dac 3, this is worth it.

Update. just compared the dac3/cd2/vbs to a audio research cd 8 and much to my surprise the bel canto was better ,in about every way. between myself and two other people listening to the shoot out it was clear that the bel canto was passing more low level information , was more dynamic and had a bigger , more open soundstage. very impressive. It was also put up against the new Wadia, the 17,000 dollar one, and it just killed it. WOW ! the wadia was dead and uninvolved compared to the Belcanto combo. I am starting to think the Belcanto is not only [good for the money] but state of the art, regardless of cost, and is sitting right at that sweet spot on the bell curve between cost and performance. The irony is that I think a lot of people will never consider the Belcanto ,because they mistakenly think its to inexpensive to be state of the art. ps I do not work for Belcanto ,just am a happy customer !

sorry for taking so long to reply. I did not compare a stock dac 3 to the cd 8. I had all ready upgraded the dac 3 with the vbs at the time of the shootout. but in a very good system, revel studio 2s, top sim audio preamp , rogue Apollo monoblocks, the dac3 vbs was better, and all of us listening thought the same thing, it was unanimous. It [the vbs] is a big upgrade. good luck, chris

scott, yes the dac 3 was warmed up , and the vbs dac 3 combo sounded more open , with better front to back separation, more low level detail, better bass ect.voices sound more real to me with the vbs by the way. going back to the stock dac three sounded more closed in and coming from the speakers so to speak, a little more rounded at the top and bottom, maybe a tad more warmth, but that could just be because its not as open and extended at the frequency extremes. I now have a dac 3.5 I am evaluating against my dac 3, will post what I think .

So, I have now listened to the new dac 3.5 vbs cd2 combo. It is with out question better than the old dac 3. this bel canto front end is now world class, for any price. some of the best digital sound I have heard to date. simply awesome. even at seven grand or so for the whole stack, it has to be considered a bargain compared to what else is out there, I would put it up against anything for any price.

Hi scott. The new belcanto 3.5 vbs is better in about every way I can think of, I am going to upgrade my dac 3vbs to .5 status. It has more bass weight, and punch. it has a larger, soundstage , with better separation of instruments but with better focus of each individual instrument within the soundstage. it is paradoxically richer harmonically but with better detail and resolution. music sounds cleaner and clearer , and sounds just hang in the air with great decay. It just seems like there is less between you and the performance. I have heard and been around lots of highly regarded dacs and cd players , while I thought the original dac 3 was very good for the money, enough that I bought one, the dac3.5 vbs combo I would put up against anything at any price, its really that good. you will have to spend far more to get better digital sound. you have to hear one for yourself, happy listening, Chris

zear, how were you able to see inside other dac 3s ? are you a dealer ? are you a dealer for a competitive product ? I have looked inside my dac 3 and are nothing but impressed with the build quality. when you post slanderous comments about any product, you raise suspicions about your motives.

VBS1 Features:
• Low Noise Switch Mode Power Supply (SMPS) provides over 90% energy efficiency, specific control over
operating parameters of the supply, and high levels of isolation with significantly lower audio band noise
than traditional 50/60 Hertz transformer based linear supplies
• Extensive input filtration, low noise rectification and high energy storage prior to the SMPS
• Massive bank of LC filtration using compound inductors, parallel electrolytic capacitors and final stage
polypropylene capacitors to ensure hundreds of amperes of peak current capability and low noise across
a wide frequency spectrum
• ½ of a Farad of total capacitance (500,000 microfarads) and over 100 Joules of energy storage
• 10X to 100X lower noise floor than traditional linear power supply
• Provides over 100 dB of isolation starting below 100 Hz
• Compact SMPS isolation transformer for superior isolation from the power line

from my experience the bel canto will take more break in, let us know in a couple of weeks or in a month, it has caddok resisters in the output stage, which take a while to break in. then it will crush that sonic frontier dac , sorry. also by looking at your system, the focals are a bright speaker, so are your nordost cables, all your tubes are mellowing out the sound, which I would do to if I had your speakers.

bill, I hear greater clarity into the soundstage, a lower noise floor, and an even bigger 3d imaging . I am very happy with the upgrade, happy listening, Chris

Hi , multiple questions so first off, the bass of the dac 3.5 is just tighter and more rock solid, with a good combo of weight and punch. I dont think you would have an issue with too much bass. I will let you know the upgrade price when I get it done, and the vbs 1 still needs a good power cord, I can still hear differences in power cords, its just not as dramatic as with some dacs. And I am suspicious of the post claiming bad build quality, I am nothing but impressed with the inside of mine.

I read the same review , and am puzzled by it, it not been my experience at all. I have compared the stock dac three, to a dac 3 vbs, and in the systems I heard them in the dac 3vbs was better in about every way I can think of. I have lots of air and ambiance in my system, if its on the recording.

Hi scott, I am located in MPLS MN, the home town of Bel Canto, SO turn around time for me was very fast, I am not sure how long it would take elsewhere, good luck ,chris

So I have been breaking in my dac 3.5 and I could not be happier, It sounded good right out of the box, bigger soundstage and better separation, cant wait to hear what it sounds like after a couple hundred hours !!!! John said they use caddock resisters that take a while to break in , we shall see !!

I talked to belcanto and they said that they are about to come out with a new software upgrade, probably next month.

update, Recently at a friends house he had a shootout between the Belcanto dac3.5 vbs vs The Wies dac 202 and the DCS debussy, long story short, the belcanto bettered both dacs, and in some ways , by quite a bit. considering the Bel canto is the cheaper of the bunch, that says alot about the Bel canto.