Matt, i find your speaker quest very interesting; I definitely am drawn to a truly full range speaker with deep extension, accurate reproduction leaning towards the forceful side; with a sense of impact and scale that some speakers sacrifice to reproduce the lower frequencies with more accuracy and a sense of finesse. I almost see it as live vs studio... Live is scale, impact and dynamic while the studio recording is more accurate with finesse and the gentle skilled hand of a studio engineer to properly reproduce every nuance.
I also definitely like my speakers with a sense of midrange texture that some may consider colored. Not overly warm or truly colored, but the harmonics that the low midrange creates that are emotion and soul. The speakers that reproduce the source with accuracy and finesse are, to me, frequently lacking texture, complexity and that sense of engaging emotional involvement that is the reason I love this hobby. it is interesting because the things you seek are attributes of the speakers you just got rid of, the EA MM3's. it's hard to settle for less than we already had. not to say that there was not legit reasons to switch, no speaker or speaker-room relationship is perfect. but the MM3's are 'big-boy' speakers and a hard act to follow. i owned Kharma Exquisite Reference 1D's for 3 years, then had other Kharma's. they very much remind me of the Martin Coltrane. i also owned Marten Dukes. then eventually i ended up with the EA MM3's for 5 years. i can see where those speakers do come close to the MM3's in some ways, but are not quite capable of the whole picture. they have that transparent and refined ceramic mid-range, and that 'Kharma' coherence. but they don't quite get the total weight and tone in the mid range of the MM3's since they don't quite have the heft in the bottom end. it will be fun to see what you end up with. good luck on your quest. i can relate to your reasoning's. |
Matt,
I heard the MSB V Diamond with Galaxy clock at RMAF.....if only on CD....which was disappointing as I wanted to hear it in high rez PCM. but my impression on the familiar piano CD that they played is that the Trinity dac I'm now using is better, more tonally complete and more non digital sounding. granted; it's thru a whole different system than my own so any concept of comparison is provisional.
but if you are considering a dac that sells for $42k......then the Trinity dac starts to become a consideration. and considering the thread title.....
I'm just say'n....
the Trinity dac continues to astound me with it's magic. if the ultimate PCM is your goal.....I think this is it.
I've been a huge dsd fan for 15 years, and my 3000 CD's had sat 'dormant' for maybe the last 10 years unloved. with the Trinity dac as the impetus, in the last month I've ripped 1500 of my 3000 CD's and acquired more PCM hirez. I now have about 7-8 terabytes of PCM to go along with my 8 terabytes of dsd. I've been having so much fun getting reaqauainted with all those CD's that now sound superb.
YMMV, just my 2 cents, and all that stuff. |
Matt,
I'm a solid state guy with my darTZeel, always aiming for natural neutrality and having a signal path that gets out of the way of the music. the Trinity is certainly that with ultimate transparency and linearity......along the lines of my analog gear both vinyl and RTR tape.
the Galaxy clock on that V Diamond is 77 femto. then there is a 33 femto clock from MSB for another $10K (which would push the MSB you are listening to from a $42k list to $52k).
the Trinity clocks are 28 femto.
I have no way of quantitating the sonic significance of clock speed. likely implementation is more the issue.
but something wonderful is happening with the Trinity and any idea of it somehow being tonally 'warm' is quite foreign to my sensibilities. having body and substance would be an operative descriptor.....like analog.
and as one's tastes develop over time these things become more and more important. I know how my body reacts to an extended listening session with the Trinity compared to previous extended listening with redbook. while it's intense I never get that 'wrung out' feeling I use to get. |
Norm,
I hate (and I mean actual hate) the Audiogon forum interface. it's mostly driven me away from the forum. but there is an easy way to get to the latest post without going through the whole thread. just select 'last' 24 hours of forum threads and then scroll down to this thread. then click on the last post you see and you will be near the end, the 'last 24 hours' does not refresh right away so many times there are posts you don't see until you actually click on the post.
I actually enter the forum from 'buy' on the main page and then select community -> forums -> 12 or 24 hours.
maybe there is a better way. but it's the least maddening way I've found. |
Is it just laziness? most high end forums are run by audiophiles....and use generic software which gets updated as part of the licensing. Audiogon is a business with a closed/unique piece of software. the forum part is an 'expense'....and not a 'fun thing' for them. not saying they are not nice people or don't want to help. but it costs money. what would be their ROI on making the change? there is your answer. |
As it stands I believe I am the first in the world to have this system and I am utterly disgusted at al of you for not thinking of it sooner. It is the proverbial "No Brainer". Matt, I enjoyed your 'poke' at all of us audio nerds who take ourselves too seriously. yes.....we can get carried away and self absorbed. but if it makes each day a little richer and makes the music reproduction better then what the heck. anyway thank you for entertaining us and I can't believe you have not had more comments.....are we really that caught up in our own stuff? I have to admit that I'm typically as bad as anyone. time to lighten up..... cheers! |
I have 17 Quad dsd files so far. done right (native) they are remarkable through the SE Lampy GG in my system. the native PCM through the Trinity is also remarkable.
original analog remastered through Quad dsd will be a crap shoot.....with variable levels of re-mastering. my next Quad dsd downloads will be analog recordings and we will see how those go.
give me the native format 100% of the time, whatever that was/is. that is how I want to hear my music. |
Matt, wonder if you’ve had any opportunity to try the SGM (Sound Galleries Music) server? I’ve used it now on the GG, the Nagra HD, the Aqua Formula, and now my new MSB Select II. it’s very, very, good and excels with Roon and HQ Player as well as MQA (which has been surprisingly impressive). in fact, it is designed around and optimizes HQ Player.....although it is flexible enough to move on to another 'engine' should something surpass HQ Player. I have my NAS sitting upstairs with my files, and the dead quiet SGM sits next to my rack......it’s a dream to use and the support is amazing. the Select II/SGM combo gets into uber analog territory in many unique ways for digital. and with respect to the thread title, the redbook is to die for.
I read back a few pages but did not see it mentioned, but there are many pages so I might have missed it. -Mike |
thanks Matt, good to be here. i will watch for feedback on the SGM, and Congrats on the LH2! no doubt there are multiple ’giant-killer’ dacs out there to enjoy these days. OTOH there are also one’s like the LH daV2 which are ’next level’. cheers. |
Matt, well, I see you have opened the floodgates to the Boulder 2150 server/dac at $65k list price. so maybe you need to now hear an $84.5k dac/passive analog preamp.....the MSB Select II. http://www.msbtechnology.com/dacs/select-features/ standard with a single powerbase and 77 femto clock. I just upgraded to the second powerbase and mine has the 33 Femto clock. after hearing the Select II at a show a few years back I could not escape that reference in my head listening to other dacs in my system, and eventually it wore down my defenses and I acquired one. I hope you can try one at some point. even if it's just at a show. that's the only place I heard one (3 different times) until I owned one. it's really on another performance level beyond other dacs I've had in my system (Trinity, Aqua Formula, Nagra HD, Lampi GG) or at shows and more in very good vinyl playback performance territory, and includes an exceptional passive analog preamp and analog inputs, modularity for future proofing, and a 10 year warranty and 'upgrade at retail difference' program that keeps it cutting edge relevant for a decade. when 'some' here look back 10 years and add up their digital investments + preamp investments, this starts to pencil. no worries if some get their panties in a bunch over the price, comes with the territory. I just had to throw this idea into the hat, now that the hat is so much bigger. cheers, Mike
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as a former Lampi Golden Gate owner i did listen to the new Lampizator Pacific dac at the RMAF show this past weekend. i was impressed by it's greater clarity and more transparent and refined character. it plays at a higher level than the GG and will likely synergize in more systems. at 22k euro's it's not cheap but at an attainable level. and it's footprint is now conventional so it will fit into more racks better, and auto switches between dsd and pcm. it is not MQA compatible; that would not stop me or even slow me down choosing a dac (even though my MSB Select II has MQA I can take it or leave it). it's one that must be considered as a contender. and you could buy it with one set of tubes and never think about it again. it does not need particular voicing to system fit like more colored dacs might. |
Matt, i'd find a bunch of piano recordings and listen to them, then a bunch of vocals and massed strings or massed voices. these are where digital has a bit of trouble in sorting out detail in the massed strings and voices and the sustain and continuousness of the piano. it's where the MSB Select II separates itself from others. not sure it will work that way for the DaVinci and Boulder, but it might. it's the ease of getting that analog rendering of the whole note. ideally in the system where you have a turntable or tape deck as a reference with the same recording. but even without those piano is the torture test.
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i use Adona and decoupling footers, or active isolation. the problem with 'uber' racks is the 'sunk' cost, and then they are impossible to sell or ship once you have them. footers have the same or better performance, and are flexible and priced more reasonably. if i was looking for the best rack with decoupling tech, hand s down it would be Artesania only. equal or better in performance but won't break the bank. |
check out Artesania. http://www.artesaniaaudio.com/ these racks are very impressive. do a little research on this rack system. other racks might look a bit more like furniture; Artesania is all business. the Artesania decouples on a level beyond those higher priced racks. if I was not buying a 520 pound turntable, and did not already own active isolation, I would absolutely own Artesania. I would never consider dropping $20k-$40k on racks that I could never sell. you better want to be buried with an expensive rack because you will own it forever. not that they don’t work, but how long will they be relevant and current tech? i use footers made in Korea called ’Hardpoint Trinia’. they ’float’ and i’m very impressed by their performance in my system, i have 5 sets of them. they are not cheap, but when compared to expensive racks they become cheap relatively. under my 3 box MSB Select II these footers are phenomenal. they work perfect with my Adona rack or directly on a hard floor. and using a modestly priced Adona and footers means I can consider changing if better tech comes along and it's all sellable and shippable without losing an arm and a leg. |
Matt, as far as the ’look’ of the Artesania; if you observe pictures of gear on it, it’s the gear itself that jumps out, not the rack. since there are no shelves to hide the gear, only the skeleton of the ’functional structure’. and whether you choose light grey, dark grey, or black as a rack frame color will change how it looks next your wall in room. and with free air flow around your gear, your gear is happier thermodynamically. i have no dog in the fight, since i don’t own Artesania or plan to buy it. only that take the $30k you don’t spend on those other crazy expensive racks, and upgrade that DaV-MP combo to the MSB Select II-SGM. as good as your reference is, there is another step beyond (just my 2 cents, YMMV, and all that stuff). and, of course, both the MSB Select II and the SGM are products created to be constantly upgraded and take the customers with them on that path. i can’t personally hook you up with an MSB Select II in room demo, but i have a room here for you to stay in should you want to visit and hear it for yourself here in the barn (compared directly to vinyl and tape). and connect with a local MSB dealer (not sure who has a Select II as a demo; I know that ’Mike’ in SW Florida just got a Select II as a demo the same spec as mine--full tilt--he is going nuts over it). |
i never claimed i’ve directly compared these products. who gets a chance to do that? have you done that? not sure i want to go back and forth with a dealer in any case. i’ve heard the MP and Dv but not necessarily the most recent versions. i have heard enough of the considered state of digital art that i do have a feel for what is out there, and do think (as i said....just my 2 cents, YMMV and all that stuff) that the MSB Select II is on another level to my ears. and i’m not alone with that conclusion. what i do directly compare the Select II to is my vinyl and RTR tape, as well as other recent digital units in my system. and I spent over 2 years and multiple audio shows listening to the MSB Select II in those shows and then trying to find a less expensive alternative that could do what it did. I could not, so I pulled the trigger. i’m just a guy with an opinion. and a system context all can see where it’s formed. i don’t care what Matt ends up with (i’m not a dealer), but if he is getting into $100k list price range digital investments, then the MSB becomes an alternative he should consider. Matt has also asked me multiple times about an in home demo of the Select II, so it's not like i'm crashing the party here. |
btw Matt, the Trina are not intended for amplifiers. possibly the reason for the flabby bass. not sure if you tried them only on sources or preamps by themselves. when I read your comments last week somehow I missed that detail. if you still have them give that a try. if you did then we just move on. i continue to be very impressed by what they do in my system, where they are under my -3- Select II boxes plus under both my Tripoint units, the Elite and Troy Sig. every system context is unique with tweaks for sure. |
currently i'm using the new MSB 'Roon capable' Ethernet Renderer on the MSB Select II, and then using the SGM server as the Roon host. i'm able to A/B that to the SGM with USB. they are too close to call so far, with a very, very slight nod to the new Renderer. there is a new 'Evo Spec' upgrade coming for the SGM server. when that happens i will see whether that upsets the stand off. i've also run some optical cable in my conduit from my NAS to my audio room where the MSB and SGM are, so we will see how that might change things, as well as trying other Gigaswitches and linear power supplies. at the top of the food chain, it's not yet clear where this is going. |
