Telarc 1812 revisited


I've posted several threads about the trackability of this record and have received many scholarly answers, with emphasis on physics, geometry, compliance, weight, angles,price and all sorts of scientific explanations about tonearms, cartridges, VTA, etc, etc. Let's cut to the chase: I have a 1970's Pioneer 540 in the garage I bought for $5 at a thrift store plus an Audio Technica cartridge for which I paid $30 This combo. tracks the Telarc 1812 perfectly without problems while my $4000 Rega and $1200 Project bounce out of the grooves.. I'd really finally like to get some explanation and resolution as to this discrepanccy
boofer
Hi Raul:

>I'm " absolutely sure that the Titan i or the Atlas or the Ortofon Anna or any other today cartridge would/could ( ? ) performs at way better quality if the cartridge tracking abilities ( by design ) were better were improved.

Been there, done that. It is quite easy to improve the tracking performance, for example by designing a wire suspension with a longer-than-normal free length. This has the side-effect of lessening the intensity of the loads on the tonearm, which can seem to be a benefit if the tonearm has a resonance-prone mechanical structure, and can improve the tracking of a tonearm with lower-grade bearings or imperfectly adjusted/unevenly worn bearings.

But doing so means that the suspension's fulcrum point will shift position, depending on what the frequency being reproduced is. This won't necessarily sound bad, and some cartridges are designed like this. But it certainly isn't accurate.

OTOH, you are free to prefer whatever you like.

>In the other side the Telarc 1812 is a very good tool to be sure about the VTA/SRA

For the Telarc 1812, yes. But since this value may or may not be applicable to the other LPs in your collection, "to be sure" may not be the best words to use.

>and LOMC load impedance set up

Ah, interesting. Can you teach me about LOMC load impedance setup? Why do you load a cartridge, what causes the need to load a cartridge, how do you determine when a load is too high for a given cartridge, how do you determine when a load is too low, what do you hear when the loading is right, what do you hear when the loading is wrong, that sort of hint would be welcome.

>The main audio system enemy are: distortions in all its forms.

Agreed, but what you are suggesting is just as likely to cause distortion as reduce it (and this is not the first time that you have done so). Trading one form of distortion for another, or increasing distortions in the name of reducing them is not my idea of progress.

kind regards, jonathan
Dear friends: For those of you that has no idea about the historic Telarc Tchaikovsky 1812 recording I share with you some information:

Cincinnati Symphony Orchestra conducted by: Erich Kunzel.

Recording venues: Music Hall Cincinnati, Emery Memorial Carrillon tower in Mariemont, Ohio and the court-yard area ( for the live/true cannons ) on the campus of the Balswin-Wallace College in Berea, Ohio.

Producer: Robert Woods

Sound Enggineer: Jack Renner

Mastering engineering: Stan Ricker.

Recording date: September 6 and 8 in 1978.

Recording: fully DIGITAL using Sounstream system.

Microphones ( Orchestra ): three Shoeps/Studer SKM-50U .

Microphones ( Cannons. ): BrĂ¼el&Kjaer.

Console: Studer model 169.

Monitoring sessions: bi-amp ADS speakers driven by Threshold amplifier.

Distributed by: Audio-Technica.

The Orchestra was augmented by 12-piece brass band.

The electronic and mechanical keyboards were manned by four players ( normally needs only one. )

It were used three autentic and different 19th century cannons, owned and manned by the Fifth Virgina Regiment. The lower recorded frequency coming from the cannons is: 6 hz.

Regrads and enjoy the music,
R.
Dear J.Carr: +++++ " But doing so means that the suspension's fulcrum point will shift position, depending on what the frequency being reproduced is. This won't necessarily sound bad, and some cartridges are designed like this. But it certainly isn't accurate. " +++++

you are the " boss " here. In all the cartridges I name here ( that can track the 1812 ), including the Akiva, I just not been aware of any sign of unaccuracy during the different playback sessions.

Which kind of unaccuracies could I find out down there?

++++ " For the Telarc 1812, yes.... " ++++

well, if we are extremely strict I agree with you: nothing is diffrent with the Telarc that with any other LP on the VTA/SRA set up but my meaning was not for that strict criterium but about that triangle/tambourine passage that when is really " right " you can easy confirm it trhough other LP's ( in the whole evaluation system process. ).

Certainly you don't need that I teach about loading a cartridge that's well know for any audiophile. What maybe you need is to read again my post on reference to that and then test in your system because you own the Telarc recording.

++++ " Trading one form of distortion for another " +++

yes, and almost always exist trade offs in audio ( as Dougdeacon posted. ) that's why I always say that is in your own overall knowledge level and skills to choose the trade-offs that makes the less harm to the audio signal and to do this we need carfully training to identify each kind of distortion sounds, with out this self training no one can do it.

Regards and enjoy the music,
R.
++++ " The electronic and mechanical keyboards...... " ++++

this is refred to the Carrillon play.

Btw, the 1812 Carrillon passages is another way to know about not only the cartridge set up quality level but the audio system resolution levels.

Regards and enjoy the music,
R.
I forgot:

++++ " It is quite easy to improve the tracking performance, for example by designing a wire suspension with a longer-than-normal free length. This has the side-effect of lessening the intensity of the loads on the tonearm, which can seem to be a benefit if the tonearm has a resonance-prone mechanical structure, and can improve the tracking of a tonearm with lower-grade bearings or imperfectly adjusted/unevenly worn bearings. " ++++++

and IMHO not only an advantage for the tonearm but for the cartridge it self and for us listeners. With a cartridge with high tracking abilities, especially with classic music,
the normal higher distortions in the last thrid part of an LP goes lower and lower distortions on this regards means more music information.

I was thinking that there were no negative trade offs ( only advantages. ) improving the cartridge tracking abilities by design till your post but you don't really explain what we have to look for during playback so it's not clear for me especially with so many different experiences with cartridges with top tracking abilities where its quality level performance is really good.

Denon, Ortofon, Benz Micro, Highphonic, Technics, Satin, Linn, Sumiko and many more choosed ( at least is what their cartridges shows during playback and with specs. Example Today Ortofon specs on tracking abilities in the A-90 or Winfeld is 100um. ) as one main cartridge characteristic high tracking abilities and their cartridges performs ( overall ) really good where Lyra choosed a different " road ": nothing wrong with that ( is your privilege. ) only makes me think more that if we want top quality sounds IMHO we need high cartridge habilities. I have no test/proved fact against my take on that critical regards.

Regards and enjoy the music,
R.