2. amps-preamps
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Upgrade advice needed

Let me tell you my story.

Piece by piece, I've been gradually building an audiophile quality system.

My system is a Toshiba Laptop w/ J River playing FLAC files into a Wyred 4 Sound DAC-2. The laptop is dedicated exclusively as a music server. I've stripped most of the background processes from the Laptop and disconnected from the internet. The only external connections are the USB line to the DAC and a Mouse connected by the other USB connector

I don't have a preamp, the W4S DAC has onboard volume control.

I'm using a NAD 356 BEE Integrated amp but bypassing the preamp module and routing the DAC input directly to the power amp. The speakers are Vienna Acoustic Beethoven Baby Grands. I use LAT International SS-800 MkII 6 ft speaker cords and Pangea AC-14, 14 Gauge after market power cords for the NAD amp and the DAC. I installed Albert Porter Outlets. I do not have any power conditioners.

I live in an apartment so room treatments and dedicated circuit wires are out.

Musical tastes are primarily chamber music and some classic jazz of 1950s and 60s.

I listen near field - 6 feet from speakers and prefer moderate volume. I don't have much interest in Home theater or television in general.

My biggest source of frustration is the reproduction of violins and pianos. I recently ripped a CD of Bachs Violin Sonatas by Arthur Grumiaux. The sound is so harsh a cannot listen for more then 10 minutes.

My issue with pianos is the percussive aspect of the instrument seems to overwhelm the musical tone. I have a collection of Chopin Polonaises and it sounds like the artist is playing the piano keys with a hammer.

Other instruments sound better -- Cellos, brass, woodwinds, vocals.

I'm wondering what the next step in my upgrade evolution should be. I been intrigued by the First Watt line of amps. They seem to be a good fit for me. But, I don't know, will that address my issues with violins?

I could spend up to 5K now and, perhaps a year from now, I could swing another 5K for the next component

I'd welcome any suggestions.
128x128cjk5933
chayro
2,927 posts
 
Use the tone controls on the amp to tone it down. You may be overly sensitive to high frequencies. I've seen it before.
lak's avatar
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lak
4,532 posts
 
Cjk5933,
Did you reinsert the preamp?
Did sound improve?
cjk5933's avatar
cjk5933 OP
23 posts
 
Thank you all for the help.

I've made a number of changes based on the suggestions and the harshness has definitely diminished.

I've connected the DAC to the preamp of my NAD amp and switched the W4S to fixed mode. That automatically moves the DAC volume to Max so there shouldn't be anymore bit dropping from trying to control the audio with digital.

I disassembled the outlet and cleaned all of the wires with deoxit

06-27-14: Almarg
What settings of the DAC's volume control do you typically find yourself using, within its 0 to 70 range? And how have you set "USB minimum volume level" and "USB maximum volume level" in its menus?
I also checked the various digital volume controls on the computer and J River. I had J River volume dialed down to 25%. I pushed it back to max.


06-28-14: Stewie
Don't assume the problem is in your system. Pianos and violins often sound harsh live (pianos especially), and the "better" your system, the more you'll pick it up. Then too, recordings sometimes unwittingly add or just emphasize distortion in the upper register of the piano.
I spent some time comparing recordings and I suspect the ones I cited may have been carelessly produced. But I find most piano and violin solos hard to listen to for long periods. Some like Chopin are really obnoxious

06-27-14: Elevick
Do you have a solid state hard drive? It made a huge difference on my laptop with jriver. Faster, quieter and runs cooler..

06-28-14: Zd542
Looking at your system, I would say that using your PC as a source is the most likely place for something to go wrong.
I take your point about the limitations of computer servers but I'm committed to this for the convenience and simplicity. This was my old general purpose laptop I repurposed as a server primarily by clearing most of the extraneous software and background processes.

I've resisted adding a SS hardrive to this laptop because my long term upgrade plan is to switch from a Wintel box to a Mac mini with external power and SS hardrive.


That includes addressing room acoustics by tweaking speaker placement and orientation

Positioning speakers in a small apartment is problematic. That's one reason I lean towards a near field system -- I think that's a more practical approach to my lifestyle. I could afford to buy a house but I just don't want the hassles. I have a similar approach to audio. I want good sound with minimal fuss. I wonder if I should sell the Vienna Acoustic floor standing and get a small Single driver monitor like Omega
zd542
5,339 posts
 
" 06-28-14: Zd542
Looking at your system, I would say that using your PC as a source is the most likely place for something to go wrong.

I take your point about the limitations of computer servers but I'm committed to this for the convenience and simplicity. This was my old general purpose laptop I repurposed as a server primarily by clearing most of the extraneous software and background processes.

I've resisted adding a SS hardrive to this laptop because my long term upgrade plan is to switch from a Wintel box to a Mac mini with external power and SS hardrive."

I didn't mean that using a PC was inferior compared to other sources. When I said that the computer was the most likely place that something could go wrong, I meant that literally. Its easy to get music out of a PC, but to get best results requires a lot of work. Ripping music, configuring the OS, picking up the right player (and setting it up properly), cables, AC products, different kind of file formats... Getting all of that stuff right is what I was talking about. In the end, the results shouldn't be inferior, or why bother?

How you go about fixing a problem like this is very important. You're either going to fix the actual problem, or you're going to cover it up. Some people like to through tubes and cables at problems. You can go that way if you want to. Its your choice. For me, the only way to fix a problem like this is to find out the root cause, and then fix that. Its not as easy, but I think you will be much happier with the results. That's why I said in my first post, that you have to isolate the problem. Looking at your last post, I still think this is a PC issue. I would still try a CD transport in place of the PC to confirm this is where the problem lies.
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knownothing
1,537 posts
 
This thread was intense, fast... and over, but I offer one other simple suggestion that came to mind in reading about the OPs situation and the suggestions received. When the NAD preamp section was returned to the loop, I would insert one of your best interconnects from the drawer, closet or shoebox under the bed in between the pre and amp sections, replacing the metal jumper bars that come stock from NAD. Audioquest makes and sells some purposed copper preamp jumpers, but I find that a decent well-made 0.5 meter IC or simple home brew jumpers with good wire and IC connectors work better than the stock bars or the AQ jumpers.
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