The Schroeder has arrived


My Schroeder Reference arrived over the holiday weekend. It has been a long wait but looks to be well worth it. The fit and finish on this tonearm is a work of art. The adjustments are actually very simple compared to many arms. Most adjustments are just a slight turn of a set screw. The arm sounds incredible. I have heard others say effortless. That seems pretty good to me as words really cannot describe how good this sounds in my system. I am still in the process of fine tuning and the wire is still breaking in so I guess it will probably sound even better. I am using a Shelter 901 on it and that seems to match up well. BTW, if anyone is looking to buy a Schroeder I would strongly suggest working with Thom at Galibier Design. He kept in contact with me throughout the lengthy waiting period and was excellent with the delivery and setup. I would though be interested to hear from any others that may have this tonearm and their thoughts on some of the cartridges that are a good match.
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Dear Frank,and Galibier systems,

Thanks for possibly ruining my summer,here in New Jersey.I was totally happy rationalizing not having to spend any more money on this hobby,for at least another year or two,and very interested in obtaining two,new,and pricey tennis rackets.These new rackets would help me to drive my "topspin" backhand past my most competitive "court" enemies,all summer long.As of now,I'm not putting enough "juice" on my backhand passing shots.You know,Frank,like "BECKER" did to Lendl and MacEnroe,for years.I had hoped to do the same,this summer,but,thanks to this NEW recent thread,along with the plethora of supporting candy(to me)from the Galibier website,I will probably have to start saving my pennies.

I'll be cursing you,Frank,every time I approach the net,and am passed by one of my "Arch Rival's" shots.Thanks Alot!!!
Dear Frank: I read, through the Thom/Galibier web site ( excellent one ) and AA , all about the differents wood arm wands Self damping: long fibres, etc.. ) and their choices about effective mass/compliances that you already post.

I don't have an intensive experience in my own system with your tonearms but I have experience with wood arm wands ( like Grace tonearm ) and with wood build audio items: TT, clamps, cartridges, etc,, and the wood like any other material has it's own " signature ": a little " soft " sound reproduction, including hard wood like Ebony.

I wonder if the bass signature of your arms has to " see " with your wood arm wands choice instead metal ones, I think that the wood is the problem with that kind of low bass reproduction.

Frank, I don't want to be controversial here I'm only try to understand what really happen with the low bass Schroeder reproduction, because I think that it will be very difficult to fix it with wood arm wands.

Btw, you have a stunning design and this is not the point here. Do you already try other materials than the wood: a metal one? how they sound against wood?

Regards and enjoy the music.
Raul.
Dear Thom: Maybe you already know that the Micro tonearm instructions for set the overhang it's different from the universal two points setup, these two method give you two differents overhang and different sound reproduction. Which one do you use it? and when you are hearing like a " machine ", how much damping do you use? and which arm wand do you use?

Btw, other way to use the MAX 282 dinamically balance tonearm is in static mode balance: here are some differences in the sound reproduction.

All these issues are very important for the evaluation of this tonearm.

Regards and enjoy the music.
Raul.
Thanks, Raul.

I was using a standard 2-points Baerwaald alignment.

I've primarily used the dial (spring) to set tracking force - of course verifying with an accurate tracking force gauge (see http://www.galibierdesign.com/images/digital_scale_adaptor_med.jpg for my interpretation of the setup that Wally sells).

I'll set the indicator for say 2.5 gms (Denon DL103R) and then adjust the counterweight until I read this on the scale.

I haven't played much with setting the spring force to zero. I know I have not worked to get the most out of this very fine tonearm.

Please note that when I said "mechanical" it was only in comparison with the Schroeder. I was searching for a means if differentiating the two arms.

I haven't used any damping - primarily because I move arms around so much that I hate making messes :-(( My suspicion (allowing of course for the very real possibility of being wrong), is that I'll prefer the arm undamped. There's only one way to know for certain however.

You are absolutely correct - that I need to give this arm more attention. I can no doubt get it to sound even better.

Cheers,
Thom
Dear Raul,
Your question regarding the choice of arm(wand) material is valid and I'll see if I can address the issue to your satisfaction.
Low frequency reproduction is quite strongly linked to the quality of the rendition of upper harmonics. This is why adding a "supertweeter" often improves the perceived bass quality of a speaker. A tonearm(wand) that exhibits pronounced high frequency resonances(a "metallic" sound when tapped) will emphasize(read: exaggerate) the leading egde of the note, followed by some, more or less well damped, ringing. The ringing obscures fine detail and decay and corrupts the harmonic envelope of a sound(of an instrument), the exaggerated upper harmonics content of the low note might be perceived as "better attack". But, when a double bass player lets go of(fingertip releasing) the string instead of plucking it, the resulting sound is quite soft, dominated by the resonating body of the instrument(sometimes difficult to locate in space). Most arms can't capture that bloom realistically. Much more in demand seems to be the kind of "funky" bass that I hear at show demos left and right..
Over the years many audiophiles have gotten used to an exaggeration of upper harmonics, resonant arms(platters, too), bad amplifiers(often solid state, sorry) and cartridges with high frequency resonance peaks as low as 12kHz(!) being some of the contributors.
And sometimes this little added "spark" might just be what is needed to compensate for a poorly designed(weak) turntable drive system or the WRONG step up transformer(veiling the original signal), creating an overall quite pleasant, nevertheless inaccurate, and ultimately dissatisfying facsimile of real music played by real people(or the event as recorded by the engineer). We have all witnessed others mistaking MORE highs for MORE detail.
So, should I design my arms to match well with severly flawed components? Certainly not.
It is not this "HiFi sound" I'm trying to adhere to, but rather produce a component with as little a sonic fingerprint as possible(there'll always be SOME signature, if only because no perfectly neutral wiring exists), one that allows the listener to differentiate between "soft" and "tight" bass, one that keeps not just the sound of A violin, but the sound of any violin reproduced as distinct and recognisable as that recording engineer managed to capture it.
I have built tonearms for more than 25years and tried ANYTHING that you could possibly(lets say reasonably) use as a material for the various elements of a tonearm. Initially I did use metal(sandwiches) and carbon fiber as armwand materials(and, upon request, still do!), but when comparing the properties of some woods to the more "traditional" materials like aluminum, steel, ceramic tubing or carbon fiber, I found those woods to be superior in many respects. For a mass produceable arm wood is a poor choice. Too many variables to compensate for, possibly inconsistent supplies, etc... But you can use the differences between various woods to your advantage, see my comments on maintaining outer dimensions while having a wide choice of eff. masses on this forum and elsewhere.
You mentioned the wooden Grace arm. Let's just say you'll never see one of my arms with a Teak armwand(but Teak was and is easy to come by in decent quantity and quality).
BTW, Ebony is not a particularly hard wood. Snakewood, Grenadill, Acacia, Horizontalwood are much harder(to name but a few). If I were to use the different woods without any treatment(this doesn't refer to a coat of wax...), each would indeed have an identifiable sonic character. But I do saturate the armwands with a variety of oils, some remaining liquid, others solidifying over a period of three to six weeks, until they all exhibit the same internal damping properties. This is rather important as the cartridge tracking a signal will "send" spurious energy down the armwand, which in this design needs to be dealt with(damped) in the arm(wand) and bearing as there is practically no energy transmitted via the bearing to the armboard to be dissipated there(the conventional way of doing it).
Reducing the internal damping or using, say carbon fiber for an armwand, will yield a sound closer to "conventional"(no disrespect intended) arms, with the benefit of near zero bearing friction(more importantly, zero "stiction"). The added sense of "zing" at the cost of a natural, non-mechanical character might be prefered by some people, all reasonable inquiries will be executed...(and so will be all unreasonable inquirers, - just kidding ;-)
Now, lastly the issue of bass "authority" or power. An example: At the last thorough comparison with a Triplanar arm, the consensus was, among other things, that the Reference arm had more authority below 80Hz and lower bass extension too(not that the Triplanar was flabby sounding, on the contrary!). Now put the Triplanar onto a different deck and the situation might be different. That's because most other arms do not only depend upon the mounting board for dissipation of energy, they also pick up energy and relay it to the cartridge. Put your turntable in the adjacent room(I know it is impractical...) and you'll see(äh, hear) what a fabulous microphone it was, sitting so close to your speakers(or in their soundfield). A SME V on a Linn LP12 has terribly illdefined and bloated bass, the same arm on an SME 20 or a Sota Millenium is capable of excellent bass performance.
My arms are far less dependent upon the mounting surface, which was one of the design goals from the start. But, as there is no possible mechanical incompability, there is also no chance for that lucky case of perfect synergy....:-).
It's late over here and I'd better hit the sack. Feel free to comment or dig deeper.

Cheerio,

Frank