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Battle of the phone pres for my system.

I have a Yamaha GT-750 with a Hana SH mk 1. I had it running into my Musical Fidelity A1 and listened through Dynaudio Evoke 20 speakers. I have tinnitus so I listen off-axis and liked the sound. I had ordered a Decware Zrock3 and hadn't considered when I ordered it how I was going to use it. When if finally came, I realized I could only use it with my transport and DAC )and it was worth every penny.)

A friend lent me their Manley Chinook so I could see how it would work with my analog front end and the Manley/Decware combo was pretty sweet. I can't afford a Manley and after removing the Zrock3 and going head to head with the A1 didn't make me feel that I wouldn't choose it anyway. After casting about, I was all set on getting a 834 clone and putting in some nice tubes. Then I read about the Softone Model 4 and saw systems like @lalitk and @macg19 . It sounds like what I would want if I put some Mullards in it (though hopefully cheaper ones). I ran across many others who could afford a more expensive phono pre using the Softtone. 

As I was searching, the google AI wanted to help so bad that I asked it what it thought. It said the Softone would match better with my equipment and gave a bunch of reasons that were things I hadn't thought of, like gain matching and cumulative power running through the system. It seemed to think that 834 would be more problematic and too much syrup.

I told AI to make the 834 work or I would delete it from the internet, and it told me to put a 5751 (less gain because of the Hana's output coming in) in V1, then a Raytheon then a Mullard. Or something like that for gain and sound differences taking into account my tinnitus and to match my system. It seemed sound thinking, but again, stuff I hadn't considered. I didn't write it down, but it made me wonder. It congratulated me on my awesome thinking on putting together my amazing system. I closed the browser to make it forget this ever happened.

I figured I thought I would ask real people what they thought since I'd prefer empirical evidence over data surfing. The other point in favor of the Softone is that it's a real product and not an aliexpress special, though plenty of people are happy with their clones, all are one and one are all. 

Thanks.

 

letch
viridian's avatar
viridian
5,786 posts
 

Interesting system. I have a Softone Model 4 and enjoy it. Couple of things. IMHO the on board SUTs are competent, nothing more, so an outboard step up, or high output phonograph cartridge (which you have) would be preferred. The 834 is excellent as well, and I would add the Lehmann Black Cube SE to your list if you are sticking with the Hana SH,

And I dont think that Softone have updated the cost in keeping with the exchange rate, so if you pay in Japanese yen, rather than dollars, the cost is around $425 plus shipping and whatever your bank, or PayPal, charges for currency conversion.

Best of luck, whatever direction you go in. And if a phone pre rings, answer it.

letch OP
117 posts
 

Thanks!

I realized that I left out an important piece of information. I'm looking for more tube warmth because of my tinnitus. I like the Hana, I think it was a good value choice. Mostly I need the phone pre so I can utilize the Zrock3. That thing is very worthwhile and would be taming highs and adding bass on its own.

But yes, the Softone is just at the edge of my budget, but seems like a solid piece of equipment. The 834 is cheaper for sure and that is attractive. I guess partly what I'm wondering is if the Model 4 is a better system match for the extra money. 

macg19
1,347 posts
 

Hi Letch

You're not going to get a new Softone Model 4 (M4) for $425. Assuming you are in the US, the cost is $800 US including shipping. Unsure what the wait is but 1 -2 months isn't unusual.

I've owned Hana carts and they are very good value.

In my system the M4 far outperformed the GoldNote PH 10 with PS-10 at around $3K.

I think most that own or have owned an M4 would agree that you have to spend a LOT more to best it, assuming the limited settings work for your cart.

The M4 isn't pretty IMO, but it is built really well (it's heavy) and seems to have a robust power supply. The mute button is a really nice feature .

I've been enjoying the M4 for about a year now, but it's not a perfect match for the ultra low impedance MSL Signature Platinum, so I'll be switching to the Sutherland Little LOCO (can't swing the DOS Loco right now), so the M4 will be available very soon.    

There is an M4 for sale now on USAM for $800. I'm guessing it is owned by AG member YYZ Santa Barbara. Mine will be less.

The M4 gain specs for the 3 settings are not on the website so here they are:

MM: Gain 45dB, load resistance 47k ohms
MC High: Gain 67dB, load resistance 100 ohms
MC Low: 72dB, load resistance 25 ohms

I use MC Low, MSL output is 0.5mv, 67dB is plenty of gain.

The KAB calculator shows 45B of gain should be a good match for your 2.0mv cart.

Lastly, while the Mullard's are great (and very expensive), I'm currently running NOS RCA 5751's which sound really good. I tried NOS Tele's and decided they are too grainy. 

I hope this helps, and good luck.

viridian's avatar
viridian
5,786 posts
 

Actually, as I said, you can get a new Softone 4 for $425 US plus the cost of shipping and currency conversion. 

Simply go to the Softone website and choose to pay in Japanese yen, rather than US dollars. The price is 68,000 JPY, which converts to $425 USD. Softone can send you the invoice in JPY and pay with PayPal, or bank transfer in JPY. Both your bank, or PayPal, will automatically charge you for currency conversion, currently on the order of an additional 4%. Surface shipping is 6,100 JPY, or $38 so that will cost a total of $463 and add in the 4% for currency conversion and you are all in for $482, inclusive of shipping, no need to pay $800. Or roll the dice buying used. 

On the other hand, I think that the 834 is the better choice for you, as the Softone is not particularly tubey and doesn’t soften the sound as much as the 834.

When I do the math out long, I get a SUT gain of 24db in low and 27db in high, corresponding to impedances of 183 and 94 ohms, irrespective of transformer losses, or resistive loading of primary, or secondary.

https://softone.a.la9.jp/english/Model4/M4-2.htm

Using the formula of preamp load impedance divided by turns ratio.

macg19
1,347 posts
 

@viridian Actually, there is no way to order online and select JPY. The price list you are referring to is dated Dec 2022.

You order by email and he sends an invoice in USD. Surface shipping will take weeks and is ill advised. 

In any case, what you are suggesting is basically a way to rip the guy off - how kind of you.

In any case, Mr. Yoshimoto is a smart guy - smart enough to know 68,000 YEN doesn't = $650 today. 

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