Phono Stage


I am getting near the end of my current system journey.  I have my digital (streaming) side set (for now). It sounds glorious to my old hearing aid assisted ears. And streaming is where I spend the vast majority of my listening. 
Regardless, I am now focusing on vinyl, with the recent addition of a P8. 
My analog side: Rega P8 w/ Hana ML > Rega Aria > Kimber KS1018 > BHK pre > Zavfino Fusion mk2 > Moon 330A > Transparent + > KEF Ref 3’s. If do a weak link analysis both chatGPT & Gemini say it  my phono stage.

So looking for potential replacements. As always I am very space constrained, (half wides are perfect) no tubes and looking to stay under $3,000 used. I like accuracy, clarity & cleanliness. 
My current candidates: 
Rega AOS

Gold Note PH10

Sutherland 20/20 w/LPS

Sutherland Little Loco

The Sutherland’s work because they are thin and con fit under my raised center channel speaker. The duo stack is too high  

Please let me know your thoughts and/or recommendations. Thanks!

 

signaforce

@audphile1 

"I felt like, with around 20hrs on Umami Blue, it was the right time to let it continue to evolve without me suffering. 
I know you’re running Hana ML which is the cartridge I upgraded from. The Umami Blue has resolution that completely surprises me every time I listen. At 100ohm the sound is meatier and sweeter than at 470 but it somehow retains the details and presents everything in a more relaxed way. Anyone with ML should consider the Blue as the next step. The difference is far from subtle."

Yes, I envy your upgrade! The cartridges in the Umami series are jewel like and an audition on my Luxman would probably push me over the edge. Life is changing at our age and we’re about to transition from having a constant income stream to relying on savings and the equity we’ve built to over the years. I was previously enamored by my Rega Planar 8 and the Apheta series cartridges it used but when I had an opportunity for a significant upgrade that was financially viable, I sprung for the Luxman PD-151 MKII which had recently gone back into production when Luman found a satisfactory tone arm replacement after their supplier Jelco shut down. I got a very good trade for the Planar 8 and my Aria MKII and there was a $500 discount that I didn’t know about if you purchased the dust cover at the same time.

Prior to pulling the trigger I did a lot of research to determine what cartridge would have the appropriate characteristics for the new SEAS tonearm on the PD-151 and would be practical economically over the long haul as well as pleasing my senses.  The ML was the best candidate at the time with regards to mass and compliance and bought it with the turntable and the dust cover as a package. The Hana also came with a two-year warrantee that I registered with Musical Surrounding who is the importer to the US as well as getting a future credit when I trade a worn one for new. I also have the advantage of experimenting with more price conscious cartridges if I should choose to do so in the future because of the new tonearm’s flexibility.

It would be fun to hear how the Blue works in your system and likewise have you audition which ever system configuration I have going at the time.

Wouldn't it be fun to have a get together some where with everyone bringing a cartridge or two to have a listen and compare?  I would like to know how my AT AR20 compares to the Blue.  For that matter either my 2M LVB or my AT LMN60xSL would be interesting too just for fun to have a MM comparison.  A turntable with an interchangeable head shell would facilitate matters.  My SL1200GAE has that, so does the Luxman.  When I was in the business years ago it was easy to set things like this up.  Now it is next to impossible.  

@davehg I am totally in your SUT camp. I run my Unami Blue into a Ned Clayton Cinemag 1254 and then into my Icon PS2, which is a simple straight forward three  tube, passive RIAA, no feedback, PTP wiring, MM phono pre. It is small and compact and offers 46dB to 50dB of gain, depending on which you believe, the manual or the published specs. I much prefer SUTs. And they don't need to cost a fortune. Adjusting loading is a simple matter of calculating the correct value of resistor and placing it across the secondary in parallel with the 47KΩ of the MM stage. Of course, one must be aware of reflective impedance limitations at the primary that the cartridge will see. For example: A 1:10  winding ratio SUT (which produces 20dB of gain) into a 47KΩ load will result in a  maximum reflected impedance of 470Ωs.at the primary. You can easily lower that value but you can never exceed it.  A 1:20 ratio has a maximum reflective impedance of 117.5Ωs at the primary. Of course the Hana Cartridges will do fine at these values and they can be easily adjusted downward. In fact most cartridge designs will be fine. Including SoundSmith's moving iron design that requires a minimum of 470Ω loading. But if you require a higher loading value for your cartridge than 470Ω,  then you have no choice but to use an active head amp, or to reduce the winding ratio and thus the gain. It is governed by the calculation: (Secondary Impedance) divided by the square of the (winding ratio). In a 1:10 case. 47KΩ/100 = 470Ω. But I love the clean path of the signal from the cartridge directly to the MM pre with no active components in between. Ned Clayton's Cinemag 1254 SUT sounds open, uncluttered, and musical, at a ridiculously reasonable price. I avoid active MC head amps whenever possible.  

@flash56 I have a phono stage en route that features lundhal SUTs for MC gain. It’s a completely different design than my current Whest Two.2 that achieves gain with op-amps if I’m not mistaken. I wouldn’t write off every single phono stage in favor of SUTs for LOMC cartridges. I can tell you that whatever you got it will face an uphill battle with something like the Whest, within same price category.