The muddy waters of Analogue vs. digital today


With new technology, everything is changing so fast it is hard to keep up with new recordings. I have had a turntable all of my audiophile life, although I admit I played mostly CDs for many years. It was only since I upgraded my analogue system to a certain degree in the mid-nineties, that I could hear that records sounded better than CDs. It wasn’t a very expensive upgrade, a used Rega 3 with glass platter, new Sumiko Bluepoint Special, and a floor demo ARC PH-3. Probably somewhere around $3K. Mid-90s remember.

Now my system is very upgraded and I can hear more differences between vinyl and streaming at high resolution. CDs have kind of been left in the dust. 44.1 resolution sounds kind of tinny and flat. I listen if that’s my only choice, but I can easily hear the difference. I credit myself with a decent ear after doing critial listening for 30+ years. My ear is not as good as most reviewers, but you'll understand why it’s good enough to write a forward to this thread.

I won’t go through the differences I hear between analogue and digital, because you’ve heard it all before. What I want to talk about is my confusion in this new recording landscape. 

I had purchased Roberta Flack’s "First Take" when it came out and I’d kept the record for more than forty years when I realized it had really seen its better days. Basically, it was unlistenable, even after a few washes in the Degritter. I looked at near mint copies of the record and they were quite expensive. Then I saw that there was a new pressing for a reasonable price.

I was listening to the new pressing of "First Take" a few days ago when I realized it sounded overly compressed at the high end. I asked my new audiophile friend chatgpt if the record was pressed from an analogue source. Nope. I was basically listening to a digital recording pressed into vinyl. Chatgpt says that most records made after 1980 come from digital sources. So, I found a reasonablly priced orignal pressing of "First Take." My grandaugher in college can have the digital one.

Today I was playing a fairly new recording of Gustavo Dudamel and Yuja Wang playing Rachmaninoff’s Variations on a Theme by Paganini. I live in L.A. and have been lucky enough to see Dudamel live many times and Yuga Wang several times. It’s a beautiful recording, wide and deep and detailed and musical. I pronounced it the best classical recording I owned. But it was put out recently. So, I checked with my audiophile buddy chatgpt. The record is from a very high resolution digital source. Chatgpt says that digital can sound more analogue on vinyl because the engineers roll off the high end a bit.

So, now things are more than a bit confusing. Do I buy a recording from before the 80’s on expensive vinyl or might it actually sound better streaming at 192 kHz? If you listen to Patricia Barber’s "Clique" at 172 kHz, it sounds pretty good. So good, i have not bothered to go out and buy it on vinyl.

Does anyone else feel a similar confusion in this modern market, and do you have any suggestions for negotiating it?

audio-b-dog

OP WROTE

’With all those choices, you obviously are making choices everytime you play the music you are happy with. Those choices might be subconscious, but why would you put an album on your turntable if you can more easily stream it? There must be a reason which you might not be aware of.’

I have 4 audios systems I switch between in my main listening room, a bedroom headphone system and living room system. Each system is picked for its own unique sound and the components were chosen for synergy. I am not searching for perfect sound... I am picking one type of sound at a time...

@audio-b-dog Mostly because you don’t and can’t possibly know what master you’re listening to on streaming. That matters as much as the quality of your playback system. In your case the vinyl setup is of considerably higher quality than your digital. Here your streaming is a more of a convenience option to enjoy the nearly infinite selection of music. It’s also an option to enjoy your CD collection. When buying new vinyl from reputable sources the information on the type of master is almost always disclosed - digital, remastered or mastered from analog as AAA. You can also read reviews. And use AI to research if a particular pressing is worth buying. 

Vinyl sounds inherently different from digital at this level. You can upgrade your digital to match the level of your analog. And even then you may still prefer vinyl. So don’t sweat it. Learn how to enjoy both formats for what they offer. That’s a better place to be. 
 

As to Qobuz or Tidal, again there will be differences in sound. 

I have been listening quite a bit to the big reissue boxes of Szell, Ormandy, , Haitink, and others.  The latest remasters are stunning it’s unbelievable how great those original recordings are.

  CD was a new medium that now as it is in its death throes has sonically fully reached its potential.

@audio-b-dog 

"The muddy waters of Analogue vs. digital today"

"But when we go out into the market to purchase a vinyl recording, how do we know how good the sonics on that recording will be? For analogue audiophiles, most new reissues or new music will probably come from a digital source unless the album says that it was pressed from an analogue source. How do we know the quality of that digital source, as well as how well the recording engineers pressed music from that source?"

Its as simple as knowing who produced the reissue. Why would ever rely on chatgpt? It's information is only as good as the sources its compiling from many of which are from forums like this one of which the validity of the information presented is dubious at best. Take what you've read in this thread for instance!

When purchasing new vinyl there is usually one or more hype stickers on the shrink or bag that the jacket is packaged in where the record company wants to catch the eye of the discriminating audiophile. Phrases like, mastered from the original analog tapes or all analog mastering or if there is a digital step, sourced from the original analog masters. There is also a lot of fine print on the lower reverse side of the album jacket that will often disclose the source, the mastering engineer and where the lacquers were cut. For instance, most releases from the Neal Young Archives, The Estate of Frank Zappa, many of the mass-produced Elvis Costello reissues. Only requires your due diligence.

Many reissue companies specialize in using all analog elements whenever possible like Analog Productions, Speakers Corner, Blue Note Tone Poet, Blue Note Classics, Rhino etc.. Then there are those that use the best possible high rez sources as well as analog, Mobile Fidelity Sound Labs, Music on Vinyl, Run Out Groove, Pure Pleasure to name a few. You can also look at who did the vinyl lacquering or the direct metal mastering. Chris Bellman, Kevin Grey, Bernie Grundman, Mathew Lutthans, Ryan K. Smith, Myles Showell and many more who don't want to be associated with anything but the best productions. As for whether you enjoy the sonics of a particular mastering or not, well I guess that's a matter of taste.

@audio-b-dog 

Congrats on the wise wife, and your taste in music

Casandra is one of my favorites, we've seen her live a few times, big/medium/small clubs.

I just listened to this twice, once to evaluate a friend’s system, and let him fall in love with her, and again here, when I got home,

It’s also another choice to have both CD and LP versions to help refine anti-skate which is the topic of another recent discussion.

I’m gonna say it again, this xa5400es Sony CD/SACD Player sounds so good that I don’t hesitate to play CDs and SACDs, or buy used ones they are so cheap these days. Sounds like you are hesitating to play them like I was before I got this with the help of members here.