Discuss The Viv Lab Rigid Arm

I don’t disagree with Atma; the physics that suggest you need to tightly couple the tonearm pivot to the TT bearing is inescapable. However, there are many other "rules" that govern modern tonearm design, any one or several of which might be violated if one were to do a close analysis of any single design. The question then is what is the order of importance of these rules with respect to ultimate sound quality with a reasonable variety of cartridges. And what are the negative consequences of violating one or more of those principles? I think you then have to listen to the tonearm in action to determine its goodness. I have already stated that I wonder about the floating bearing (is the pivot well fixed in space? That’s another imperative.) and the skinny undamped arm wand (Will it resonate?) Yet the Viv float has been reviewed many times, and I don’t know of any reviews that were less than enthusiastic. We have already heard from two users of the Viv that they like it quite a bit. So it may be a "bad design", but it sounds good to most who have auditioned it. Certainly one does not want to dismiss such a product out of hand.

I might add that the Viv has a weighted base, and it is designed to be placed on the surface of the plinth, adjacent to the platter.  Thus it IS to some degree physically coupled to the bearing, to the degree that the plinth and bearing are tightly coupled, and the plinth will move if the bearing is disturbed.  So maybe the coupling between arm and bearing are tight "enough".

@neonknight everyone can develop a theory and the more you read, the less you can choose or decide on arguments. Now that you have heard all arguments do you know what to do ?
What if you just decided to try it ?The truth is in the listening don’t you think ?

@rauliruegas 

I go regularly to concerts of un-amplified music.  I don't regard that a home music system is good because "I like it."  I regard it as good only to the extent that it reproduces acoustic music in real space as close as possible to what I hear at an acoustic musical event.

You obviously listen to a great deal of home music through an analog system or systems.  Compared to others therefore you. like me, are listening to a great deal of measurable distortion (certainly more than in good digital) and yet we may very well find that the analog music we hear at home is our best possible representation of an actual musical event, clicks and pops notwithstanding.  I, for one, am not concerned at all if some alleged "scientist" measures or does not measure a great deal of distortion in my system.

So it may be with the Viv.  If it makes records sound like the real thing, I would be unconcerned with anyone's measurements of it.  That may make owners of conventional arms uneasy.  I have a conventional arm.  I am not uneasy.

@lewm     Have you ever read a negative review of ANYTHING?  Most publications rely on advertising revenue.  If an item doesn't cut it on review, it simply doesn't get published.  By the way, if you re-read my post you will see I am not bad-mouthing this product.  All I am saying is that like nearly all components, some will like the sound and some won't.

@atmasphere   I agree with your endorsement of the usual criterion that there must be a tightly engineered connection between platter and stylus.  I think the issue with the Viv is not the freestanding base - it weighs 2kg and if the underside is of a suitable material that does not slip, it is not going to move around on the top-plate of the turntable.  I think the slop problem arises because the liquid pivot allows too much movement.  Just a few microns will allow the stylus to change location relative to the platter and read signals that are not imparted by the groove.  I sometimes wonder whether conventional gimbal bearings are really good enough to give zero slop.

There is one simple fact that everyone seems to ignore out of politeness. I would rather rely on the physics of a mechanical situation than what anybody thinks they hear and I include myself in the anybody. The only accurate thing you can say about the Viv is that it is a silly design on several accounts and anybody who buys one has a poor understanding of the situation. Try this, intentionally twist your cartridge 5 degrees in the head shell and listen to what happens. If you hear nothing wrong either your system or your head does not image. It is the rare system that does image at the state of the art. It is the easiest aspect of HiFi performance to corrupt.