Record Cleaning Machines

@oldaudiophile,

If you read this article  Precision Aqueous Cleaning of Vinyl Records-2nd Edition - The Vinyl Press - at the end you can download the 145-page book for free; Chapter XIV is exclusive to UCM.  There is a lot of information describing the variables associated with UCM.  

The position of the transducers does make a difference, firing directly at the record will get the best cleaning performance.  Fundamentally during what is called the ultrasonic rarefaction phase, the pressure drops below the fluid vapor pressure and essentially the fluid boils creating a bubble and over a period of rarefaction/compression cycles the bubble that is formed grows until the surrounding hydraulic pressure violently collapses it. The cavitation bubble duration is very short - about 4 milliseconds - check this video starting at about time 6:20 https://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=ul ... %3DHDRSC3;.  The collapsing toroid jet in an UCM is some what direction. 

The KL Audio at 200W and the Degritter at 300W with their limited bath volume are very powerful and can be very effective with just DI-Water.  The low power units such as the Kirmuss need some chemistry such as a surfactant to help with cleaning, but add too much chemistry (or spin the records too fast) and the 'cavitation intensity' decreases.  I know of people who use the Kirmuss with some chemistry as a preclean and then final clean/dry with the Degritter.  The Kirmuss with its spinner makes it very convenient to use with the Degritter.   The Kirmuss unit can also be easily modified to add a good pump/filter system.

Otherwise, people have been using UCM to clean records and similar type plastics for >50 yrs.  The biggest issue is over-extended operation and subsequent over-heating.  If you read the Degritter manual Degritter-manual-v2.2-ENG.pdf - it has a cool-down process which will kick in after two Heavy cleanings.  The nice option for the Degritter is spare tanks that can be used for rinsing (if using chemistry) or to improve process time when using the Heavy cycle.

I have both a generic 40 kHz tank and 135(?) kHz sweeping US tank from Vibratto.  I use both, and noticed an improvement when I added the 135.  I spin the records in the 40 first after applying disc doctor cleaner, and then in the 135 that also serves as a rinse tank.  I use the basic first generation cleanervinyl rotisserie and filter the second tank.  Air dry with a small fan.  Definitely worth the price.

As an alternate thought, I believe that if you are gentle with the records, follow the directions and proceed carefully, all of the machines do a good job.  From the most simple (spin clean, etc.) to the most expensive.  What you pay for is how much time and effort you want to put in.  In general, if you spend less money, you spend more time.  And visa versa.

I haven't owned the Kirmuss but i did consider it seriously.  I watched the manufacturers videos and read Michael Fremer's review.  I believe it works well.  But, the effort involved is quite significant.  I own a Hannl Mera ELB.  Very high end vacuum machine.  It cleaned records very well.  But to me it was too fiddlely (sp?) and time consuming.  Set the hight of the brushes, apply the solution, wait while cleaning, manage the vacuum cycle to avoid static electricity, turn it over and repeat.  In the end it worked well.  The record was wet cleaned and static free.  But cleaning several records waisted an entire morning.

The Kirmuss was a great price but the process seemed even more labor intensive.  In the end I bought a Degritter and could not be happier.  Set it up, turn it on, insert the record, push the button and do other things.  When the chime sounds the record is clean, dry and static free.  I actually like cleaning records now.  Is it better than the other systems? I don't know.  Does it clean the records effectively and efficiently?  Most definitely.  Is it easier and more enjoyable, absolutely.

You guys are great! Thanks so much for this additional information! May the music gods bless you all!

Actually, I have read and still have a copy of the Aqueous Cleaning 2nd edition thing. I guess I need to read that again more closely.

So, guys... bottom line... will 3 grand get me better audio performance over what I'm dong now or will it be just a time saver?

@oldaudiophile
I too am deciding between the Kirmuss and/or Degritter.

Although one can save $ on a more home made Ultrasonic record cleaner solutions, the Kirmuss seem to perform with the best RCMs as reviewed by Fremer:https://www.stereophile.com/content/analog-corner-287-charles-kirmuss-vinyl-restoration-system
“….was left with a gleaming, shiny, like-new-looking record, even more brilliant than a similar record cleaned with the Audiodesksysteme G;läss Vinyl Cleaner.”
“All of these records sounded very good prior to "restoration," doubtlessly because I took good care of them and kept them clean using, in recent years, the Audiodesksysteme cleaner. Now their top ends sparkle as never before.”
“Best of all, when I played it—holy crap! The top end was fully restored, the backgrounds were superquiet, transients were sharpened, and the amount of inner detail—particularly the microdynamic shifts..”
So my conclusion is the Kirmuss is at least amongst the “best” at cleaning vinyl records.
ElusiveDisc often has a cheaper package deal while UpscaleAudio has a 3 LP version- both are on sale now.

The Degritter at $3k is cheaper and a newer design than AudioDesk.

KL Audio has exited the automatic RCM market likely due to high repair costs.

I thought about chasing which ultrasonic cleaning frequency is “better” or is “gentler” on the vinyl, but gave up as to not be important rabbit hole to chase- they both work great

If budget a concern, get the Kirmuss. If convenience a concern, get the Degritter.

Looking forward for your report on your new RCM. Thanks for supporting this forum community