Pass amp paired with audio research pre?

Bdp24:

I suspect you’re correct. The LS 16 may well be the culprit.  The reference 5SE is supposed to have a more dynamic sound, and will hopefully resolve this for me. 

 Markcdaniel makes a good point in that may have to get away from the audio research preamp altogether. Audio  research does have its house sound which can be a bit un-involving at times.

 I have read some good reviews of the Ear products but have never actually listened to any.

 Trying not to add too many variables to the mix. Trying to take an incremental approach...?

Thank you for your note! Hypothetical. Trying to think about where I should go with future purchases. I live in the sticks. Not much opportunity to listen to other components. I try to read and ask questions.

Been thinking about audio research reference 5SE, Audio research reference phono 3, pass labs 250.8.

I have a VPI classic 4 with a transfiguration Proteus cartridge…

@fanotunes
If you are thinking about solid state Pass Labs is a very good choice, but since you already have the RM200, I see no point in changing out the amp- the RM200 is pretty neutral so I would not think for a moment that is is responsible for the excessive laid back quality.

Before changing anything out, I’d consider replacing the tubes in the line stage and possibly the input tubes of the amp. Its common if those tubes get weak for the preamp or amp to get a bit ’sleepy’- which might be easily described as ’too laid back’. You may find no need to do anything else once that is done!


After making sure those tubes are not an issue, I would then investigate the phono cartridge loading. The loading is there for the preamp, not the cartridge- its meant to prevent ultrasonic or RF resonance inherent in all pickups from messing with the preamp. The correct loading (if the preamp is sensitive to RFI; ours are not so no need for the loading with LOMC cartridges;) is the **highest** value that prevents the resonant circuit caused by the cartridge inductance and the tone arm cable capacitance from going into excitation. Since each cable is different (and thus the capacitance is not predictable), cartridge manufacturers make worst case recommendations; this can result in a duller presentation, since the loading resistor means the cartridge has to do more work. This in turn results in a stiffer cantilever that is less able to trace high frequencies. That is why its advantageous to work with a preamp that does not have the RFI sensitivity in the first place- and then no need for a loading resistor.

Audio  research does have its house sound which can be a bit un-involving at times.

Your situation sounds similar to my own.  I've been there, done that.  I spent several years trying to eliminate that lifelessness.  After replacing my speakers, turntable/arm and power amp the sound was a different lifeless.  I got down to my least suspected components - ARC PH-7 and Ref 3.  Jumping ship to another brand was a revelation.  I know people love ARC.  I did.  Things change.

ARC owners can sometimes resemble owners of Linn ;-) .

Ouch! 😂😉