I listened to it 1-2 times, but I couldn't make a comparison. But there is worse out there.
Well, a Walker table can be interesting, but whatever you do, it will influence the sound and no one knows, is it better or is it only different. The DaVinci is a different solution and you can use any Arm you want. I would prefer it to a Raven any minute of the day, but the latest one (forgot the name) from DaVinci could be interesting too. It has some design solutions from the AAS. |
it is like waiting for the results of a Pregnancy Test during the whole listening session. |
Dgad, that is not true. I bash nothing. I listened to that table more than a dozen times and there are differences between it and others. It is a discussion like everything else (cartridges etc.).
I can understand, when someone thinks about a change. Why not? Is it a religion? I am sorry, that I am not one of those, who support the internet sales based on private contacts to a manufacturer. I don't have such contacts. I am a regular customer who gets all from Dealers, not from direct delivery from manufacturer like you.
I am fine, when you can't hear differences, but please don't badmouth me. |
Dgad, what you write is not true. Probably it disturbs the internet promotion, but I guess, that is the German way to try to discredit someone who does not support the direct sale. Anyway, it is the way it is. I know some products good enough to write a few sentences about it. I respect the work from TW Acoustics, really, he is succesful and he made his way. But others did it too, but without to discredit uncomfortable opinions. but tell us, What is so remarkable about the Raven that someone should have no right to think - and write - different?
The Form?
Well, it is more or less a copy from Micro Seiki
The Platter?
Nothing special, lot have similar ones (without the AC option which was introduced from Micro Seiki)
The Belt?
Hm, had them. Nothing special, there is better out there.
The Motors?
Average, at best. I know a few owners who run it with with other units.
Technical innovation?
The material is from car industry and is about a few bucks per pound
Vibrationcontrol?
Not existing in the construction.
Engineered knowledge?
No, it is copied from other designs. No problem with that, others do it too, but the VTA adjuster is made from someone else etc.
When someone writes he thinks about a change and I write, I can understand it, what's so bad about it. do you want to force someone to stay?
Please don't be the Internet mouth from the Designer. I know how they react and it is the following way:
It starts with
-the writers System is not good enough
-the writer wanted to have it, but he didn't get
-the writer wanted a better price, but he didn't get
-the room is not good enough
-and so on....
and when nothing helps, because the writer could afford it easily but he don't want to have it because he owns better:
Then private emails will go out to discredit him personally.
That is great. I have absolutely no respect for this kind of "Marketing support". |
It is ok, I like to read such messages. But is it allowed for me to buy US Products?
Dgad, Please?. I want to support the US economy and the discriminated listener but you write I should go back to a German forum because you don't like what you read?
Hm, you prefer censored information? Fitted with untrue rumors and some fiction? I will wait a little bit, sooner or later they will "inform" (via you) that I was responsible for 9/11....
You don't get it. that's ok for me. |
Audiosix, thank you for your valuable information. It is good, when you support those, who can't read 1 or 2 sentences properly. It would be very helpful, when you will show us that you are a German Designer who is specialized in Electronic repairs and that you know all kind of amps, preamps and that you repaired them all.
Not with original parts, but who cares. Btw. are there more here from overseas who will continue pickin' on me without any information for the thread? |
Definitely a serious improvement. 3 weeks ago I did visit a Multi Motor Raven on a Vibraplane, the owner told me, it was a HUGE improvement, even when all motors on the VP. Minus K is also interesting but take care with the weight.
But you can check it easily without spending much money. Try it with a tube from a Bicycle. Next cheap step above is not using the delivered Mat from Millennium. It is like a LP12, you can do a lot to improve it. You can also try a record clamp... |
You can do the pencil Test:
Record on the Table-no move-with the stylus into the lead out groove- all amps activated- Volume up to 50% or higher !!:
Struck with a pencil
-at the rack
-at the platform where your TT sits on it
-at the TT Chassis outside
-at the chassis near the platter
-onto the platter
-near the needle (1 inch)
and check what you will hear through your speakers.
Real good designs will let you hear close to nothing, others will hurt your ears.
The Vibraplane is quite good, normally used for electron microscopes. They are too cheap in my opinion, normally for use in Hospitals/Labors. Cheaper than a cable...I guess when it would be "made " for High End it would cost 12.000 instead of 2000. Anyone see High End equipment in Hospitals? HRS/SRA etc. racks for life saving electronics?
No?
Any idea why?
Or you can do comparisons with Belts. Could be possible you will get better results with 1 really good Belt (Specs!) and 1 motor than with a regular belt and multi Motors. Or 1 good motor can be better than multiple average motors...
A good belt is available for 80,-- And that's High End price.
Anyway, a VP is better than nothing (worst is glass or stone) |
Hi Axel,
before we go back to 1.class school:
Do you know what a motor has to do?
To fight a battle? |
Well, it can be a endless discussion when you don't know what you hear. Most today "like" something or they read an "article/review" in a magazine, save 3-4 sentences from it and after a while they are transformed into "experience/knowledge".
Sometimes I wonder (no, wrong, I stopped that) how many Audiophiles think, what a Designer does is perfect. Ultimate. Lots are able to make enough money to buy expensive things (but only with a good discount of course/review "winner"), but on the other side they have absolutely no idea what these units are doing. And they are not seriously interested in that.
And even in the next life these discussions will go on...
One way to avoid it, is to try to visit audiophiles and listen to their Systems, sooner or later you will hear differences...the only decision you have to make then is:
- Do I "like" it or not...
- Is it right or wrong....
"In the kingdom of the blind, the one-eyed man is king"
You know, these 3 sentences... |
