Cables more hype than value?

What would we do without Nonoise and his rapier wit! One day he might even answer a question!

Cheers

Rok, well, I declare! It appears that you are softening your stance; that's a good thing, IMO.

A couple of thoughts: Logic will only get one so far. Music and logic don't always mix. Listen to 20th century classical serial music to hear the ultimate expression of logic in music, and note (pun intended) how in most cases (not all) it doesn't sound like music at all. And yes, I understand how from some logicians' viewpoint, one has nothing to do with the other. That's just not MY idea of logic

****Hell, I wish I could hear wire****

This may come as surprise to you, but don't worry about it. Just don't insist on telling us we can't; at least not in a provocative way, anyway. But really, don't worry about it. You can appreciate the beauty in Mariano's playing, and as far as I am concerned that matters a hell of a lot more than all the wire stuff. Now,

****BTW, just curious. Can any of you Ferengi(stng) hear the differences between two brands of 'mere mortal' wire? Say, monster and blue jeans?****

Yup, you better believe it. If you ever decide to take me up on my offer, we can make those the two control cables. Just let me live with them for a few days and let's listen to some 'Trane. No, wait! Sorry, some early Wayne Shorter.

BTW, have you heard his record with Milton Nascimento "Native Dancer"? Beautiful!

Hi Irv, actually, I am not arguing. Arguing, discussing; whatever. I truly am trying to understand the other side of the argument; which, frankly, I don't see a lot of evidence of on your part. But, for the record, my reference to posting history was for ALL posting history. Yes, this thread is about cables, but this forum is about much more than cables; including music. See, from my vantage point it is almost impossible (pointless) to discuss any aspect of this hobby without, at least, some reference to music. I think that this is the core difference between the two mind-sets.

My evidence is that these cables measure identically in terms of the audio signal they output, that they follow well-understood mathematical models. Don't get confused by this discussion of capacitance and inductance, even if those parameters vary a bit it doesn't mean that the audio signal that comes out the other end of the cable is modified in some significant way - that's a different matter, and depends on the designs of the electronics or speakers being discussed.

As for the rest of your post, it is completely analogous to the discussion of spirituality when discussing evolution. Music and cables are orthogonal. The cables only know about electrical signals, not about music. You are simply obfuscating the issues here.

You are not trying at all to understand the other side of the argument. It is disingenuous to present yourself that way. If you tried to understand how the technology worked that makes your audio avocation possible you would understand the illogic of the position that cables can have audible signatures. Like I've said, the only way to make an audio cable have an audible signature is to purposely design it to abuse some simple parameter of conduction.

Irvrobinson & Rok2id, what cables have you guys used in your systems?

It's possible the cables you used have similar sonic characteristics so can't find a difference in your system?

When I was using Krell amps, MIT and Transparent were my favorite cables. Their IC sounds the same but MIT SC is more open where Transparent is darker. If you throw in Nordost, the sound completely changes and it was very very OBVIOUS.

It seems that every one missed my post!3-10-13 @chayro,the main part of the post was directed @ rok2id,whatever!I will say my facts again that is the forum buster for non believers,Hi Irvrobinson,I believe you hear just fine!,you have after market high-end audio cables on your system,obviously you had to hear a difference with the cables you have versus lowes hardware store brand cables,I believe this,you bought the high-end cables you have!,The samething can be said about Rok2id,He has the Beldin Blue jean cables,HE hears fine as well!again,Obviously he had to hear a difference between the Blue jean beldin cables versus lowes hardware store brand of cables,again,I believe this!,He bought the blue jean beldin cables,It does not take science to see between the lines here!,they hear cable sound differences just fine!however,I believe they take the stance that they do, is they do not agree with the high cost of cables such as mine!,believe me when I say this,I do not agree with the high cost of cables myself!,Irv and rok,unfortunally I had to pay the cost of admission!the pay off is incredible to say the very least!,no not all high priced cables are worth the money,I agree!the same can be said about componets,lord knows I have seen my share of modest priced componets,speakers,cables,etc..blow the doors off of some multi thousands of dollar equipment out there,its not common,but it happens,to tell you two gentlemen the truth,I got very lucky that my cables are in the few out there that are the best available,I am blessed from God above to have a system period that I have, and I thank him daily for what he has given me!,the synergy between the system and the cables I have,to me of course,Is flawless!,I know the both of you gentlemen do not want to believe what I am about to say next,My sound would not be possible without the cables I have!,very emotional,chills running rampid all over a listeners body with tears of joy flying about,The music is so real sounding!IMHO!,the reason I expressed this to you gentlemen is I have never had eanybody over my house after the listening experience of my system that believe cables do not make a difference!A toast to all,cheers!