Can you ever go back and be happy?

The planar transducer (the electrostatic or, in the case of Maggies, the electromagnetic diaphragm) weighs less per square foot than the air it has to move, which automatically gives these devices their always incredible transient response. This is what's so addicting, regardless of brand.

It's really not about those other (albeit important) issues of box, dipole, loading, dispersion, etc, etc. Sound once begun, travels relatively slowly, but sound initiates with almost the speed of light.

The electrostatic transducer was actually invented at Bell Laboratories prior to the invention of the electomechanical cone-type speaker. There was no mylar and the diaphram was made of cow intestine stretched over a frame with copper wires stapled to it. After a few days, it didn't smell so good and the idea was put aside :~))

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GREAT IDEA FOR A THREAD!!!!!!!!!

I am in serious negotiation with myself about getting into a electro/planar or hybrid model speaker and cant wait to here the posts to come, and to my knowledge although limited has never heard of anyone going back to a box speaker..again great thread.

Yes it is possible. I've done it. About 6 years ago I bought a pair of MartinLogan ReQuests. Not pure electrostats, and maybe not in the same class as some of the other planars you've listed. Even so, I loved the way they looked (IMHO still one of the most aesthetically pleasing speakers ever produced), and I loved their speed, transparency, and clarity. The way they conveyed female vocals was particularly mesmerizing.

On the other hand, the bass integration was not seamless (fast planar, slow woofer), they were extremely finicky about EVERYTHING (placement, sitting position, cables, amp...), they lacked lifelike dynamics to my ears, and there always seemed to be some upper frequency hash that made their top-end sound aggressive even though they were a bit rolled-off. Spent a lot of time swapping cables and components to partly address the top end issue. But the real kicker was that I've never been treated worse by any manufacturer in any business. Otherwise, I might still own them (or one of the newer ML models).

So after a few years I sold the MartinLogans. Came within hair of buying some big Maggies, but moved to a smaller place and decided to go back to boxes. Since then, I have owned several very nice box designs that I've been quite happy with.

I'm currently living with a pair of Merlin VSM-M's - fast, clear, detailed, crystalline top end, and while they don't hit 20, the bass they do put out with the BBAM is quite refined and satisfyingly deep. Soundstage isn't as big as with a planar, but they are close to electrostatic in the rest of their presentation, and (to me anyway) have fuller, more natural dynamics.

Not wanting to get into a debate over box v. planar - they each have their merits and disadvantages, and I could certainly be happy with a nice pair of planars from a reputable manufacturer. Just answering your question: for some people, there is "life after planars."

Hello,

As a previous owner of Magnepan 3.3 and 3.5 for 6 years, and now owning Soundlab A1's for 4 months, I can tell you that all planars speakers are not at all alike. Ribbon-based systems such as Magnepans and Apogee are very different altogether.

Just last week I heard the Maggie 3.5s vs. Apogee Duetta in a local audiophile's system. They both "loaded" the room very differently. I have heard box speakers that have a sonic signature right in the middle of these two products. The Maggie had much more presence in the lower half of the frequency range and the Apogee had far more presence, clarity and extension in the upper half. Nobody would have ever guessed these were both ribbon speakers as neither really bettered the other in areas one would expect a ribbon speaker to excel. Electronics were BAT 31SE line stage and 400wpc hybrid Counterpoint amp that are fully capable of driving either speaker and showing their sonic strengths.

Several years ago I auditioned Maggies 3.5s vs. three different mid priced ($3k-7k) Martin Logans at a dealer. The ML's had an incredible see-through quality but otherwise they were just way too analytical and uninvolving. The Maggie 3.5 brought on a level of musicality that was simply wonderful. Both speakers were clearly dynamically limited compared to the wonderful cone-driver-based Paragon Jem/Jubilee also at the dealer. And this was something I had retained in the back of my mind. I could never have lived with the Martin Logans whereas the Paragons were a wonderfully musical speaker.

When I went back to the dealer for a second listen to the Maggie 3.5s, I also got a chance to hear the 20s. They were so much alike that I simply could not understand the 20s costing 3x the price of the 3.5s. There was clearly a Maggie "house sound" just as there had been a Martin Logan "house sound".

I ended up with the Maggies but struggled to find amps that would bring out more of the dynamics in the music. This is why people continue to claim Maggies need lots of power. It is because we need to crank them up and push so much at them to bring on the dynamic capabilities but ultimately it just does not happen.

Finally, because of the lack of dynamics and wanting more punch in the bass, I sold my Maggies and went with the Talon Khorus. Wow, now this is a great speaker. Far more frequency extension, low-level resolution, and of course awesome dynamic capabilities. The Maggie 3-dimensional midrange magic was clearly reduced but I had a degree of musicality with the Talons that was so far beyond the Thiel 3.6 and 2.3 I was using in my HT system. The Talon was one of those great discoveries.

After a year with the Talons, I simply missed the Maggie magic so I got another pair; the Talons were moved to my HT system. Once you get used to the Maggie magic, you can't get it out of your head. So to answer the issue as asked by Teajay, the move to the Talon dynamic speaker was outstanding but I'd classify it as a lateral move as there were major gains but also losses vs. what the Maggies could deliver.

I was so happy to get the Maggie sound again but I missed the many qualities of the Talons. I got more out of the Maggies with Wolcott amps. But a year later I had concluded that it was time again to find a speaker that would bring on the Maggie magic but not have all of it's limitations. And like before, I soon realized you just can't have it all in a speaker in this price range.

Then I heard the Soundlab U1 at a dealer and the A1 at my home. In both cases, I had the Maggie 3.5s right there to get an idea of the sonic similarities/differences. Quite surprisingly, the Soundlabs and the Magnepans have very similar tonality. But that was where the similarity ended. I quickly realized how the Soundlabs have a musicality unlike the analytical sounding Martin Logans I had heard before directly against the Maggies. All electrostatics are not the same.

I was able to compare the A1's vs the 3.5's in my home system with CAT JL-3 amps. The A1's retain every quality, including the 3-dimensionality and presence of the Magnepan and yet the A1's move far more air due to their nearly double surface area; there is simply more "activity" going on with the A1's. The Maggies are big but the Soundlabs are HUGE! The A1's have extension at the frequency extremes the Maggies simply can not touch. The A1's have dynamic capabilities that again, the Maggies can not touch. The A1's have clarity and resolution the Maggies can not touch. So for me, FINALLY, I found a "planar" speaker that truly does it all like one would only expect from a dynamic speaker. If it were not for the Soundlabs, I would have abandoned planar speakers altogether. But! Now that I have heard the true greatness of planar (Soundlab) speakers, I am eager to hear the same caliber of cone/box speakers. I suspect the likes of the Avalon Eidolon or the Eidolon Diamond, VonSchweikert, Verity, Dynaaudio, etc. to name a few, could give the Soundlabs a run for the money. I would love to get the Avalons into my music room for a listen.

Another member, who recently has made such a change is Albert Porter. He has a lot of experience with the Soundlabs and yet he has changed to the Dali Megalines. I suggest you read his virtual system comments on what he has experienced with the Dalis vs. the U1s he previously owned.

John