Brinkmann Bardo vs Transrotor Fat Bob Reference

Hi AQ, the Fat Bob Plus is really excellent, very smooth in operation and as you say it has a stunning musical presentation. Thanks for your further insight into their design. Transrotor have just superior design, engineering & forward thinking. It is really simplistic to simply say direct drive is superior to Transrotor's TMD. That is like saying Lexus is superior to Rolls Royce.
Regards,
MG.

Melbguy1: "It is really simplistic to simply say direct drive is superior to Transrotor's TMD. That is like saying Lexus is superior to Rolls Royce."

I did NOT say direct-drive is superior to anything. I own all three drive systems: belt-drive, idler-drive, and idler-drive. All three are capable of good sound. But when it comes to direct-drive, I hear the same argument against it over and over again, i.e., if the platter is directly attached to the motor then therefore it will have vibration and no way of isolating it. My view is that the motor and platter share the same bearing and it has only one single moving part which is running at such slow speed at 33rpm that vibration isolation is not even needed. I see the mechanical simplicity as a plus and hence my fondness of it. Of course there are other issues that can haunt a DD system such as cogging, servo speed, magnetic shielding, etc... and those are valid objections. Nobody said it's perfect.

The TMD system is very clever and to me more elegant than their FMD or the one used in Clearaudio Statement or EAR Disk Master. I have no doubt it is a quiet table and offers the mentioned good sound and I am happy that you're enjoying it. Hell, I would like to try one myself. Again, my comment was directed at TR's response to the DD motor/platter isolation issue, which is a non-issue to me, and hope people can just move on to addressing other meaningful analog issues. I am certain people will bring up the same argument again and again... just like life.

Audioquest4life: "In fact, the combination of TMD and outboard motors used caused quite a stir in a German magazine a few years ago due to the extremely low measured distortion; comparably lower than some direct drive models."

Do the said direct drive models use the same bearing as the TMD? I rest my case.

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When I first read about TMD, I was enchanted. What a great idea! I was actually ready to buy a Transrotor with TMD, before I started my investigation of direct drive and idler drive. I still think the Transrotors are fine turntables, but now I see TMD as the interposition of another drive motif between the belt itself and the platter. So, I would be wary that the TMD system adds unwanted compliance where there is already some unwanted compliance from the belt itself. (Did I read somewhere that some Transrotor aficionados prefer to pass up on the TMD option? If so, that's telling.) As someone else said, direct-drive could be thought of as a form of TMD, but with any true direct-drive motor, the force (torque) that controls the platter motion would be more powerful, less compliance between the stator and the rotor=platter than with pure permanent magnet TMD. I make no judgement for anyone but me.

Lewm: "I would be wary that the TMD system adds unwanted compliance where there is already some unwanted compliance from the belt itself."

Maybe this is the reason the EAR Disk Master uses noncompliant gear belt to lessen the compliance in sum with the magnetic force. TR can probably use something less stretchy like mylar tape or film. I was enchanted by the TMD too and still think it's a great idea.

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@Lewm,

"(Did I read somewhere that some Transrotor aficionados prefer to pass up on the TMD option? If so, that's telling.)"

Not from me:)-. I cannot substantiate that statement. I went from a non TMD bearing assembly and then upgraded incrementally until I had no more upgrades to make. I started with the 80mm platter (teller auf Deutsche) and the TMD bearing assembly. My initial impressions of that first upgrade to the TMD and larger teller; increased transient response, better attack, and more bass.

I am very happy with these upgrades and thus cannot relate to any negatives about this type of setup. I love to listen to music, what you and others all do, and at the end of the day, equate such mods, as basics for men in particular, as my wife has stated, the same as modding ones Harley Davidson or Corvette.

On another note. I just love what you did with your DP80. I have a DP62L that needs some serious work, I want to bring it back into service for our living room system. I do not know where to start. It spins, but the front Denon light is inop and the arm is bent ( a result of a very Psychotic ex-wife). I only have one arm, the bent S arm, and only one weight. I hope to revive it someday, I need to find someone who can do some repairs. Do you have any tips? Thanks.

Ciao,
Audioquest4life