Wow, I heard things on tape I never heard before

Hi Norman,

I'm glad you're enjoying your RTR machines.

One of the advantages of tape made by Maxell and other Japanese Mfrs is that when the rest of the world restricted the use of Whale Oil in the binder resin, Japan didn't. They STILL slaughter whales with impunity.

The rest of us switched to urethane resins that are stronger, but are hydroscopic. While it presents a different sets of problems, chemistry seems to have solved those problems.---------

There is another factor to consider. Are you willing to spend more money on machines that will take advantage of tapes that are state of the art -2010?

The only, and correct answer, will be; you do the best with what you have.

Norman, I only use ATR tape . I don't buy it on an ATR reel, and in an ATR box for about $55 bucks, for 1/4 inch tape. I buy pancakes for $33 each and put it on reels I pick up on ebay at about $7 bucks each. A new box is $2 if you buy 75 or so. I get new tape , reels that are cheap and new white boxes all for a total price of $40 bucks. or so , each.

Bette Spitz tells me they are in business to sell tape.. If they purchase reels and boxes from others, they need to add on costs that won't improve the sound of the tape; it just increases the price. The only competitor is RMGI in the Netherlands. RMGI buys boxes from China but their reels from the USA. Freight both ways and they're still about 10% less than ATR tape. I think it's easy to figure out the reason.

RMGI has a large facility, as did Quantegy. In a shrinking market, it will be the Abatross around their neck. ATR Magnetics will become the supplier that those who embrace analog recording will turn to. It's a great ending when the only one left is the best. As Dennis Miller says" It's only my opinion, I may be wrong." I love this quote!!!!!

I'll be driving to ATR Services in a few months and I'll take photos of their tape manufacturing facility and post it on Audiogon. Those that are interested will see why a reel of tape costs what it does.

Your thoughts will be appreciated.

Ken

Ken, isn't ATR essentially Ampex 456? Comparing the two, they seem to have the same color, smell (yeah, different brand smell differently..Scotch 206 makes me flash back, but that's another story) texture etc. They also seem to record the same. I have not had to reset my bias when using it as that is a pain on my consumer machines like the Pioneer (my personal favorite) Sony or ReVox. On the Crown it's a cake walk, but even there I don't notice a huge difference between the ATR and a Maxell UDXl.

Interesting story about Maxell and whale oil. I had never heard that before. There was a small studio in Indiana that used to mix down to Maxell tape. Almost all other's used Ampex, a few would use Scotch. I haven't tried the RMGI which I think uses the BASF formulas. So, it should be very good tape. I see that Quantegy is still offering professional 2" tape on there web site. Do you know if they are manufacturing again?
Thanks Ken.
Norman

Norman,

Quantegy 456 is a + 6 tape; it can be biased 6 DB above 0 VU. That just enables you to hit the tape 6 DB above the noise floor to get a better STN ratio.

ATR tape is a + 10 tape due to its formulation but that doesn't mean you can realize that degree of performance on any tape machine. Older machines in particular don't have a high enough bias frequency to excite a + 10 tape.

Even though the ATR machines will excite a plus 10 tape most are biased at a plus 6 or slightly higher. Most studios that use ATR tape or the RMGI 468, also a higher bias tape, stay at the + 6 level for safety sake. Transients can cause problems if you're pushing the tape to it's limit.

Quantegy, regardless of what they say about producing tape again, will never enter into manufacturing again. Their equipment was mostly sold off as scrap metal when the company folded. Their plant in Alabama is sitting on what could be considered a potential super fund site resulting in a building that is not salable. They offer 2 inch tape as that is all they have left and it is not that much in demand. A pancake roll of ATR or RMGI 2 inch tape goes for about $260 without a reel. When you eat up $500 of tape per hour tracking with a 16 or 24 track machine, recording a band paying big bucks per hour, you can't cut corners with tape that might be bad.

FWIW, when Ampex went under the brightest of those working there struck out on their own to keep analog alive. Greg Ortin started Flux Magnetics producing the finest tape heads in the business. Jay McKnight started MRL Labs, Ray Dolby, Dolby Labs and Mike Spitz started ATR Services and just a few years ago ATR Magnetics.

The tape community is really very small as everyone knows everyone else.

Ken

Ken, and I thought I was knowledgeable. Thank you for the post and all of the great information. I am going to order a few ATR pancakes, as I have plenty of empty reels laying around.

Keep in touch.

Norman