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Phono stage revealing limitations of cartridge?

Hi,
I just purchased an Ear 834P for my system. This is my first experience with tubes. I hooked it up and I immediately noticed an improvement over the stock phono stage on my integrated. There was a much more three dimensional presentation. However, after listening for a few minutes, I realized the sound was very thin, light on bass, and the highs were bright and grating. Also, the output of the Ear is really high, so much so that the volume knob on my amp is almost all the way at the bottom and moving it very slightly results in a dramatic increase in volume. I'm wondering what is causing the bright sound. Here are the possibilities I've come up with:

1. The Ear 84P is just revealing the limitations of my cartridge which the stock phono stage had just smoothed over.

2. The stock tubes in it have gone bad. (I'm planning on trying out some Jan Philips 5751's on it to see if that lowers the gain a bit.)

3. The unit is defective/the person that modded it screwed something up.

4. I'm getting some very low level RF interference. You can't here it at all when music is playing, but if you turn it up all the way you can hear it. Perhaps this is causing the brightness.

5. The Ear and the Rotel integrated are a mismatch.

I've tried using a different cable from the phono to my integrated and that didn't change anything. I also tried using a different input on the amp. I tried both MM and MC to confirm that I am using MM.

Does anyone have any suggestions? I'd be really grateful if someone could help me get this sorted out. I know there's a lot of questions here, but I thought tubes would result in warmth, not brightness!!!

BTW, my system: VPI Scout/JMW-9, Sumiko Blue Point No. 2 (2.5 mV), Signal Cable Phono Cable, Ear 834P Deluxe Phono Stage (modded but w/ original tubes), Rotel 1062 Integrated Amp, Blue Jeans speaker cables, Infinity 3500 speakers (circa 1981)
sinisterporpoise68
tpsonic
1,092 posts
 
I like to have gear plugged in and running for three days,before evaluating.It allows the connections and power supplies to "come up".
A pair of the original Mullards may be your cup-of-tea.
sbank's avatar
sbank
3,378 posts
 
EAR/Cart mismatch, gain overload sounds likely. I agree that a Dyna 20x is a good choice; be careful it comes in a high & medium output versions. Other carts to think about include Denon 103r, Shelter 501, whatever you can afford in the ZYX line. If you have a friend who can setup let you try something with lower gain than the Blue Point, that will help you diagnose if this is the core issue. Cartridge loading also shouldn't be ignored!
I'm not going to debate the merits or not of the EAR, but say that before you think about selling it for anything, you should get a better handle on the root cause of your trouble. Experimenting with another phono stage and/or cart is best way.

Also, fine to power down and swap tubes just a couple minutes later. When they are cool enought to touch, you're fine. Ideally, gloves or a small towel will help you avoid getting oils from your fingers on the tubes; not the end of the world, but easily avoided.
I bet if you post about it, you can find other A-goners in your neighborhood willing to help you...Cheers,
Spencer
sns
3,003 posts
 
Did you try some of the other inputs on Rotel, some may have more gain/different impedences than others.
After much research, I decided to go with the Dynavector 20XL, installing today. You should take advantage of the MC input on the EAR, get a low output cartridge. Can't help you with the store.
sns
3,003 posts
 
Its hard to believe there is a gain issue, I ran my Blue Point Special with 50db of gain with no problem. On the other hand perhaps there is an issue with this amount of gain into that Rotel pre stage.
Sbank, the Dyna 20x comes in a high and low output version, 2.8mv and .3mv respectively. The Ear should handle the low output version just fine. Sinisterporpoise should get the low output version, this could very well solve the overload problem as well.
Sinister, you could also save yourself the hassle of having cartridges installed for you, learn to mount them yourself. Get something like the DB (I use) or many other fine ones and practice with your lower value cartridge, or buy a real cheapy for practice. Its not rocket science, just need a lot of patience and a steady hand, and some guts when you have a real expensive cartridge.
sinisterporpoise68 OP
63 posts
 
Sns,
I did try some different inputs on the Rotel. I started off using the CD input and then tried the AUX and Tape 1 inputs last night. Those allowed much more play with the volume knob, so I'm fairly certain those have less gain than the CD input. It actually did help things a bit. I had a lot more control over the volume.

And thank you for your faith in my cartridge installing ability. It's not the alignment I worry about, it's the getting the clips on and off the cartridge that worries me. I really don't want to break the tonearm wire (did that with my music hall). But I do realize that's something I need to learn to do.

Thanks to everyone for their help! I really appreciate it.
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