So when is a SUT really needed?


Hey,

So, I been in this audiophile world for about 6 or 7 years now, at least that is when I bought a bit more serious equipment. Before that I had some stuff but wasn't that serious about it.

Still consider myself a newbie but have gained much more knowledge about this hobby compared to before.

But there is one piece of equipment that I hear about all the time but didn't really take a look at it before.

I am referring to the Step Up Transformer.

Just recently I started to read more about it and watch YT videos on it.

I also googled the purpose but it's just technical jargon and I rather get feedback from real people and users.

So, my understanding is that a SUT is used to control a MC Cart and it would work between the TT and Phono Amp connecting to the MM inputs (is that correct)?

But if you already have a Phono Preamp with MC adjustments, do you still need a SUT or is it used more in the situation where you may only have a MM preamp and want to use MC Carts?

Also, are all SUT's passive equipment, meaning they do not utilize a power plug or are there some that do?

Would there be reasons to use a SUT if you already have a good phono preamp with all the same adjustment options?

Thanks

jay73

@jay73 

This is a case where the cart really should come before the horse.  Whether or not you need a Step Up Transformer (SUP) critically depends on the output level from your cartridge, and what input levels your phono stage can deal with.

By convention, cartridge output level is measured in milliVolts when playing a 1-kHz sinewave with an amplitude equivalent to 5-cm per second.  Many test records have a track like this.

Moving Magnet (MM) cartridges typically have an output around 5-mV, which is suitable for almost anything having a phono input.

Moving Coil (MC) cartridges usually have much lower outputs, from 1-mV down to 0.2-mV.  At the low output levels, the cartridges are known as Low Output Moving Coil (LOMC) and they need much more help to increase the gain.  All other things being equal, increasing gain also increases noise.

Gain options include phono stages designed for MC, SUPs, or both.  A SUP is just a transformer with two coils of wire, that converts voltage as the ratio of the number of wire coils on one side to the number on the other.  In a perfect SUP, there would be no power loss - for any increase in voltage there is a corresponding decrease in current.

You can replace a SUP with a powered amplifier to boost the output voltage - a Head Amplifier.

In general, there is a trade-off between output and trackability - the ability to precisely follow the groove.  For good trackability, you want low effective tip mass, which means smaller parts and less output.

There's another subtle consideration.  MM and MC cartridges must generate electricity, which reduces trackability as generating power electrically 'stiffens' the stylus.

More recently, practical optical cartridges have become available with a massive 70-mV output.  They are separately powered, have very low tip mass, very low noise and very good trackability.  The downside is that they respond to position, not velocity, so special equalizers are needed to replace the normal phono stage.

Once you have selected a cartridge and your phono / equalizer equipment, you will be in a position to judge whether a SUP makes sense for you.

Hope this helps

@jay73 

Simple truth is just about any solid-state MC preamp will have the facilities to match to just about any MC you want to use with it. There are certain exceptions where MCs have a very low internal impedance and as a result very low output voltage which can be accommodated by matching it with an appropriate SUT or a transimpedance type preamp. Otherwise choosing an SUT over solid-state for most MCs is purely subjective or a matter of taste.

"Need" with a MC Phonostage: No.

Correct, not power cable, just line in and line out. It is passive. So what's the point?

I was wondering that myself, added a Zesto SUT to a Rega Naia rig, and an EAT eglow petite. It changed the sound to something fuller, more organic. I was surprised, as I did not expect anything, given that it is just a passive transformer. I am in the more skeptical league of fine audio adjustments, never heard a difference between any cable. The SUT was about as much a difference as between two carts, or suboptimal and optimal impedance/capacitance setting on a phono state for MC/MM cart, or maybe +/- 0.2 g VTF adjustment on a cart.

The sound was not objectively bad/worse without SUT, it has a different flavor. You may like it better with or without. I don't think there is a way to predict the outcome.

my 2c, or rather 300000c. LOL!

What’s a “SUP”?

Longer explanation of SUT to follow when I get out of bed.

OP: "So when is a SUT really needed?" Ignoring Esoteric Designs:

When, in the natural progression of things, 5 below, you finally try a LOMC Cartridge (Low Output Moving Coil).

MC theory: precisely controlling the movement of a smaller/lighter mass, the coil, can be better than controlling the movement of a larger/heavier mass, the magnet). The smaller/lighter the coil, the lower the output signal strength.

Makes Undeniable Sense, thus Eventually you must hear LOMC for yourself. 

1st you get a TT with a Moving Magnet Cartridge, probably elliptical stylus shape, more than likely aluminum cantilever.

2. You need a MM Phono Stage to both boost the signal and perform reverse RIAA Equalization that occurred during recording, which boosts the highs to minimize noise and cuts the lows to reduce the bass wave lengths to reduce the wide bass groove widths, to get more music on the 12" disc, which, because of the benefits of this scheme was designated ’Long Play’.

3. you learn about advanced stylus shapes, and stiffer/lighter cantilever materials, move up the chain of MM cartridges, perhaps buy used, perhaps get involved in re-tip/re-build/upgrade worn or broken cartridges.

4. you ’improve’ your MM Phono stage. All my preferred choices have been Tube MM Phono Inputs, either in a vintage receiver; preamp; integrated; or separate MM phono stage.

5, Finally Try a LOMC Cartridge. They have ____? signal strength; and their coils have _____? Impedance

6. Learn about Step-Up Transformers, because MM Phono EQ Gain is not enough for LOMC weaker output signal strength.

7. Learn about Impedance (Ohms), because while SUTs are Passive, and might include optional windings to produce optional voltage gains, they also passively/resultantly effect the impedance that the cartridge’s coil will be loaded by. Each gain option effects the Impedance Load differently. 

8. Impedance Guidance Formula: Coil Impedance ____ Ohms x 10.

A LOMC cartridge with a coil impedance of 10 Ohms would have a recommendation for Impedance Load of 100.

Many (I’m tempted to say most) simple/basic MM/MC Phono stages, the MC impedance load is 100 ohms. Specs, often found in the device's manual, should give the Gain and Impedance answer(s), as well as minimum signal sensitivity and overload.

Coil of 12 Ohms ....

My chosen SUT and some info I gathered

https://www.audiogon.com/systems/11318