Audio Research and Wilson Sabrina

@samzx12 

I have had Wilson Sophias for several years with many many different ARC amps and preamps.  I owned the REF 75SE for several years and absolutely loved it.  It was a perfect match for my Sophias and no strain and much higher db that you are needing.  I got a REF 150SE for a short time and heard no appreciable difference.  Doubling power doesn’t do much for output, just a few db.  The REF 75SE is such a great amp and design, I think it actually sounded better.  The design is so much better also for the bias.  Adjusting the bias on a 150 is a major PIA where you can easily check it whenever you want and dial it in on your REF 75.  I highly recommend staying with your REF 75 until you are ready to move to the newer amps.  I got the REF 160M a couple years ago and that was a definite upgrade over the REF 75.  I would expect the new 80S or 160S would provide a similar upgrade but stay away from the 150.  The 150 also has a more unpredictable resale value.  I bought one a few years ago for $4000 and have seen them also go for $8000+.  The REF 75SE has a very solid value around $5000.  If you could get an 80S for around $8000, I think that would be a great upgrade.

@samzx12, one thing that you don't mention is what you are dissatisfied with in your current setup.  I think that identifying what it is that you feel is lacking will give some guidance on possible upgrades (whether it be amp, DAC, cables, cartridge, room treatment, etc.).  That being said, I have an ARC REF 6 and Sabrina X's with Shunyata Sigma cables in a small dedicated room with no treatments, 12x12x10.  I have a Pass Labs 250.8 amp.  I also have a REL s/510 as well.  I think that the REF 6 and the Pass are an excellent combo for the Sabrina X's.  You get the nice tube sound from the REF 6 with a "tube-ish" sound of the Pass with plenty of power into 4 ohms.  I too listen at lower volumes, in the 85 db range and sometimes when I really want to rock out, no more than 95db.  I generally listen to jazz and classic rock.  I have never used an ARC amp, so I can't help you there, but I definitely can recommend the ARC REF 6/Pass Labs 250.8 combo.  At least for me, and we all hear differently, and our room setups play a big role in the ultimate sound, you get the best of both worlds.

As an aside, I have used both ChatGPT and Grok for advice on components.  Both gave similar advice but reach different conclusions.  They are interesting but far from infallible tools.  Nothing beats listening to something in your own system and room obviously.  In my case, I have been considering replacing my ARC REF 6 with a D'Agostino Momentum HD -- another great matchup with Wilsons, not because I am dissatisfied with my REF 6 but merely so that I don't have to worry about replacing tubes and the availability of tubes in the future.  One said decent idea, the other said that the REF 6 would give me more of the sound that I like.  Neither came down firmly on one side or the other.

I would like to point out one other thing:  Most people believe that the improvement in sound by installing proper room treatment is a far more significant improvement in sound quality than switching from one excellent component to another.  Maybe after you identify why you might want to change amps, you should take a look at room treatments first if it is practical to do so, i.e., WAF.

@jahatl513 why do you think the Ref6 outshines the Ref75SE? This confuses me. 

@dhite71 thank you for the first hand experience and participation in this discussion.  The biasing of the 150 series I had forgotten about until recently and the 75 is a piece of cake.  

@samzx12 

You are welcome 

You are correct to question the statement about the REF 6 outshining the REF 75SE.  This is 100% incorrect.  The REF 75SE is a world class amp and will always be a world class amp, regardless of what preamp you are using.

@moto_man I’m not unhappy with my setup to answer your question.  I was just asking or wondering if the Ref75SE is enough to satisfy the Sabrina.  The consensus seems to think YES :)  

You bring up a great point about room treatment and I've tried to address a few. Bass traps were a fantastic addition but they were cheapies however did a good job.  The other treatments are panels i can move in and out because I do not have a dedicated room unfortunately.  Thank you for pointing this out as you are 100% correct.