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Striking a balance between musicality and resolution

As my years and experience in this hobby continue to grow I notice a divergence between those seeking extreme resolution and detail from their music reproduction systems and those in search of maximum musicality.

In theory, high-end audio systems should provide more than garden variety stereo systems. In my view that means more detail and information should be heard from a high-end music reproduction system than one hears from ordinary HiFi stereo systems set ups. BUT is there such thing as too much resolution and detail in a stereo system’s sound presentation?

Some people feel that a less detailed presentation that is easier for your brain to process has better flow and provides more enjoyable listening.

So there is the dichotomy. Should one pay more to hear less? Can a frequency response performance that is curtailed at both frequency extremes be desired and praised?

Those that seek a “more musical” presentation usually point to their belief that that is how they hear live un-amplified acoustic music in the real world. In nature, high frequencies attenuate and decay with distance from the source and sound waves get absorbed, diffracted, reflected, and diffused by the environmental factors and landscapes; so they are not wrong in stating that in the real world the sound of music is less detailed and extended. The issue is that when we listen to our music reproduction systems at home we are not listening to live un-amplified music in a concert venue, but rather professionally produced audio recordings typically recorded with close-microphones techniques.

So the question is, do we want our systems to reproduce the sound on the commercial audio recordings accurately or does one want hear the sound the way one thinks that it should sound?

Lucky for me, I have enough systems at home that I have been able to design, set up, and tune them for different targeted resultant sound, sound presentation, and sound qualities. For instance, my OKTAN6 ultimate horn system is a dissecting microscope, my Pinnacle horn system aims at extreme musicality, and my WAAR reference system is a chameleon, which can be adjusted to sound exactly how you want it to sound in real-time.

My “test-bed” system takes on the sound character and sound qualities of the components in use and it is excellent for evaluating what new components have to offer or bring to the table in terms of sound qualities. But with the Acapella TW-1S ION plasma super-tweeters extending the high frequencies, the TBI Emperor subwoofers extending the low frequencies, and the highly detailed & nuanced Digital Audio Denmark AX24 DSD dac streaming HQPLAYER as the source, the “Test Bed” system is a highly resolving system.

As with everything else in life, is there a happy medium or compromise that gives you the best of those worlds? I believe that there is and that great music reproduction systems can be tuned to strike a balance between musicality and resolution. If one listens to the evolution of my OKTAN6 ultimate horn system for instance you can hear that the fine tuning is driving the sound in that direction.

So during last night’s listening session I adjusted the sound of my “Test Bed” system to a more musical sound presentation. The “Test Bed” system is always in flux so it allows me to experiment, explore, tweak, tune, and have fun with it.

Here is an audio recording from last night’s listening session that captures the revised sound presentation and conveys the sound qualities that exemplify a more organic sound versus a more delineated & resolved sound presentation:
 

The Way It Goes

 

carlos269
mahgister's avatar
mahgister
15,057 posts
 

I am interested by acoustics concepts and hearing theory not by DSP in itself and you confuse my interest for Choueiri explanations and understanding  with technology competition.. It seems you read what you want to read ...

 

I dont enter pissing contest by the way...

I piss in my own way...

I wish you the best and i believe your are good in your job this does not means that audio is centered around your gear understanding and that Choueiri is a marketer compared to you ...

i dont need to buy a device to read about acoustics be it Choueiri articles or others...

Choueiri is an acoustician you are not ....

 

@mahgister I didn’t reply to you earlier to let you off the hook since in a way I feel sorry for you and your situation, of being enamored with DSP filters that you have not even experienced for yourself and I will leave it at that. I have been playing with studio spatializers for years, from the original Roland units with the joysticks to the Desper Mastering Digital Spatializer, and my favorite the Quantec Room Simulator. The BAACH system has taken advantage of the high processing power of today’s DSP’s but this isn’t ground breaking work.

 

carlos269's avatar
carlos269 OP
483 posts
 

A big takeaway for me from this thread is how many people struggle with simple reading comprehension and read what they want to read into someone else’s writing instead of reading and taking a moment to think about what was just stated.

Everything is interpreted by some in the most extreme ways. I like posting audio recordings of my systems because they speak for themselves. 

While I was away  I experienced a great analogy. I am working on a project and I was putting a report together and while putting some pictures I took I noticed something in one of the pictures that I was not aware of. Although I was the one who took the picture and obviously I was there physically, I had not acknowledged a certain aspect of what I was reviewing. Audio recordings of one’s systems serve in the same way, many times I notice certain things that escaped me in the moment in the listening chair. Why is it so easy for people to see the power and extreme usefulness of pictures, videos and visual artifacts but these same people fail to find the usefulness and power of audio recordings, specially when our entire hobby is based on the premise of the accuracy of audio recordings? Some people are so limited in vision and understanding that the words “YouTube” blinds them from looking any further. These are simply audio recordings that just happen to be embedded in videos but many dense individuals simply cannot get passed that.

When you listen to your favorite album do you ever ask yourself if that is how it sounded in the studio or in the arena? Probably not but you record your system and share it and that sound cannot possibly be representative of what it sounded like in the room. I guess some of us have a higher capacity for knowledge and understanding than others. It is very frustrating to get others to see and understand what should be obvious.

mihorn
910 posts
 
carlos269 OP  Second, no one ever claimed that you can asses a home system in absolute terms through audio recordings on YouTube or otherwise. The principle here is, if your brains have the capacity to comprehend it, is that the audio recordings allows one to make “relative” comparisons of the resultant sound of the recorded home audio systems.

+1. 

Many audio related business pros here are scared that they lose their customers due to people figure out how ugly sound current audio technology is. They don't want their customers to know the truth of audio. They want the audio in mystery forever. They want the people are confused in audio and merry-go-round. YT is the best thing ever happen to audio world just like the information hwy benefits every aspects of the human life "if you can use it wisely".  Alex/Wavetouch audio

kennyc
3,058 posts
 

 

@kennyc You also seem to require reading comprehension course. In what world does “striking a balance” equal “maximum” anything? I guess reading the words doesn’t always gets decoded correctly in some people’s brains

@carlos269 - like the pot calling the kettle black. We don’t strive for maximum, extreme, or balance, we strive for personal enjoyment 

 

 

kevemaher's avatar
kevemaher
426 posts
 

@carlos269 

I like a lot of what you are saying. I also have a Physics degree. I have also worked in industry most of my career (some guest lectures at Stanford...). Spectroscopy and instruments derived from spectroscopy and optical detection are my main areas of interest. Most of what I've learned has counterparts in audio.

I got back into audio about 7 years ago as my ability to pursue athletic goals has declined. I moved to a new house. I assembled my system there and didn't like the sound at all. So got REW and started characterizing my system. Gee, peaks and valleys everywhere! What to do? First attempt: get some traps (from Real Traps by Ethan Winer). I got enough to tame some of the resonances, although not enough to make the room acoustically dead. It helped, but I wanted more mid Bass/lower Midrange.. Stuck. I got a 1/3 octave graphic EQ. Worked great! I tuned my system for days to get flat FR (+/- 4 dB was the best I could do) from 20-20KHz. Didn't like it at all! After some reading and a lot of pondering, I decided to create an FR that gently slopes downward at about 1.5-1.8 dB/octave from 30Hz or so upward. This created the sound that resonates with me.

Clearly, I'm more interested in musical than in detailed.

(BTW: I realize that I could EQ more accurately with software derived filters. I've done that and was not pleased with the sound. I admit I have a very Analog bias.)

I go to opera and concerts regularly. The sound created is purely acoustic. It reverberates in a room that has been expressly designed to create beautiful sound everywhere in that room. the sound of live music in this type of hall is quite blended, not detailed. My reference hall is the War Memorial Opera House in San Francisco. I was just there this last Sunday for an opera. 

I have attempted to recreate what I feel is that sound: slightly bass heavy, attenuated higher frequencies and a warm mid-range. I will never reach this goal, but I have gotten to a sound that I thoroughly enjoy. 

(BTW, this works very well for rock and jazz.)

I realize that others may have different goals. 

I am so grateful that there are tools available today that allow us to fine tune the sound from audio systems to our individual taste.

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