How good is the crossover in your loudspeakers?


 

I just watched a Danny Richie YouTube video from three weeks ago (linked below). Danny is the owner/designer of GR Research, a company that caters to the DIY loudspeaker community. He designs and sells kits that contain the drivers and crossover schematics to his loudspeakers, to hi-fi enthusiasts who are willing and able to build their own enclosures (though he also has a few cabinet makers who will do it for you if you are willing to pay them to do so).

Danny has also designed crossovers for loudspeaker companies who lack his crossover design knowledge. In addition, he offers a service to consumers who, while liking some aspects of the sound of their loudspeakers, find some degree of fault in those loudspeakers, faults Danny offers to try to eliminate. Send Danny one of your loudspeakers, and he will free of charge do a complete evaluation of it's design. If his evaluation reveals design faults (almost always crossover related) he is able to cure, he offers a crossover upgrade kit as a product.

Some make the case that Danny will of course find fault in the designs of others, in an attempt to sell you one of his loudspeaker kits. A reasonable accusation, were it not for the fact that---for instance---in this particular video (an examination of an Eggleston model) Danny makes Eggleston an offer to drop into the company headquarters and help them correct the glaring faults he found in the crossover design of the Eggleston loudspeaker a customer sent him.

Even if you are skeptical---ESPECIALLY if you are---why not give the video a viewing? Like the loudspeaker evaluation, it's free.

 

 

https://youtu.be/1wF-DEEXv64?si=tmd6JI3DFBq8GAjK&t=1

 

And for owners of other loudspeakers, there are a number of other GR Research videos in which other models are evaluated. 

 

 

bdp24

 

A good number of hardcore Maggie owners tear into the crossovers that Magnepan installs in their speakers, especially the guys who frequent the Planar Speaker Asylum.

One easy mod is to replace the stock binding posts with ones from Cardas; the Cardas posts fit in the stock holes with no problem. While they have the back plate off the speaker, they bypass the fuse block (it contains parts made of ferrous material!), which may easily be accomplished by simply moving the round tin connector on the end of the internal connecting wire from the fuse block to the binding post, no soldering required. Of course soldering the wires onto the posts is even better.

The crossovers in most loudspeakers contain compensatory parts---parts needed to deal with problems inherent in the speaker’s drivers. Maggies don’t; Magnepan crossovers are simple "textbook’ filters (1st, 2nd, 3rd, or 4th-order. That’s 6, 12, 18, or 24 db/octave).

Owners of earlier Maggies (X1.6)---which have parallel crossovers (X1.7’s have series crossovers)---have the great option of bi-amping their speakers. Hook up the output of your pre-amp to the crossover, and use one amp for the woofer, another for the midrange/tweeter drivers.

I have a pair of Magnepan Tympani T-IVa (the precursor to the current 30.7), which came with an external crossover. But it is inserted between a single power amp and the Tympani’s, one of the crossover’s output jacks going to the two separate bass panels, the second set of outputs to the midrange/tweeter panel. That crossover contains two filters: a 3rd-order low pass at 250 Hz, and a 2nd-order high pass at 400 Hz. Running the Tympani’s in this manner is of course not bi-amping, and ignores one of the main benefits of bi-amping: removing bass frequencies from the signal the midrange/tweeter amp "sees." Removing them allows for more power to be available to the midrange/tweeter drivers (bass frequencies use up most of an amp’s output capability), and with lower distortion (thanks again to those darn bass frequencies).

In the Tympani owners manual, Magnepan actually encourages owners to bi-amp their speakers, using an active crossover. I have the great little active crossover First Watt used to offer, the B4 (get it? wink), which provides 1st, 2nd, 3rd, and 4th order filters in 25 Hz increments from 25 Hz to 6275 Hz. The B4 is completely discrete, no OpAmps or ICs. With the B4 a Tympani owner may not only enjoy the benefits of bi-amping, but also exactly duplicate the speaker’s stock crossover. AND enjoy the benefits of not putting the signal through the stock Maggie crossover.

By the way, Magnepan offers their flagship model---the aforementioned 30.7---in both Standard and "X" Series versions. Rather than spending the money on the upgraded version, I would instead choose to spend it on a good quality external crossover and second power amp. Unfortunately, the 30.7 contains a series crossover, not a parallel one. So to bi-amp it one must perform internal surgery. Not for the faint-of-heart! Not a problem with the Tympani’s---they all had parallel crossovers. In 1973 I bi-amped my first Maggies---the original Tympani T-I---with an ARC passive x/o and two ARC amps.

 

exactly even the $26K willson watt pupies were totally flawed watch this be amazed! ( he fixes them! ) 
As Danny points out , no speaker maker is going to deliberately make error in sound a huge blip , gap spike , hole in a graph of frequency response, an error ! it is funny how some people seen to think these things are deliberate and not a mistake
they THINK they want their speaker to sound like crap deliberately ! NO  ! 
https://youtu.be/pIt2pcQvf6M?si=QuDGheuswLyF_2-2

 

The link @ned1000 posted above is the second video of a 2-part series Danny Richie made on the pair of Wilson Audio Watt/Puppy Series 8 loudspeakers a customer sent him.

 

Here’s part 1:

https://youtu.be/Tma9jFZ3-3k?si=nJTc2qlLVhmK3WVR

 

And here’s part 2:

https://youtu.be/pIt2pcQvf6M?si=RzZbPLKteA4DqhaZ

 

I imagine there may be a fair number of negative responses to what Danny has to say in the videos. All the usual arguments against Danny, with the added factor of Wilson being such a revered brand. All I can say is: I don’t consider it a given that David Wilson or his son are better loudspeaker designers than Danny Richie. In my opinion these two videos actually make the case for the exact opposite. You are of course free to disagree.

You may not be aware of the fact that Steven Stone gave GR Research "The Best Sound Cost No Object" award at the 2013 Rocky Mountain Audio Fest in The Absolute Sound. In one of the two videos above Danny talks about the sound he heard in the Wilson Audio room at RMAF.

 

Being one who has "hot rodded" speakers for several decades (including earning a patent for my own design):

It is impossible to describe the before/after results of "upgrades" unless you strap yourself down in front of the speakers and actually listened to them.  Even those with excellent command of vocabulary, and engineering degrees can't fully encapsulate the sonic benefits of "doing it better."

My goal is never to "paint a mustache on the Mona Lisa", but rather respect the intent of the original designer who, perhaps, would have  benefited from being free from production considerations, ease of in field service, time and budget constraints. And, of course, newer materials and newer "thinking" that were not around when the speaker was developed in many cases.  Not long ago, I saw a promotional video of a well-respected high-end manufacturer introducing their new "flagship" model, highlighting the assembly process.  A pair of good $30 side cutters and a roll of silver solder would have immediately improved the focus and detail, while reducing the harshness of the upper midrange  As I stated before: "production efficiency, and ease of service in the field." Price: over $40k/pair.

We perform mods on speakers in various price ranges, including vintage speakers.  I am still surprised (often stunned) just how much music you can get out of these boxes via cheap and/or vintage drivers when you get things out of way that make them sound worse -- or just open them up, and let them play.