Speaker choice: impedance, sensitivity, and tubes


Looking at most speakers' specifications I cannot help but notice that very few are rated 8 ohms, and most dip well below their nominal specifications at certain frequencies. This makes makes me wonder how audiophiles with tube amplifiers select their speakers. Most tube amps have 8 and 4 ohm taps only, and from what I understand tube amps don't take kindly to dips in impedance. Is there a rule to abide by when selecting a speaker to match well with a tube amp when it comes to impedance?

Same with sensitivity. Perhaps not as important as impedance, but a lot of popular brands out there have disappointingly low sensitivity (85-86 dB). Why is that? I never understood it since the higher sensitivity, the easier it is to drive a speaker without having to have a beast of an amp. Seems all manufacturers should be striving to design their speakers to have higher sensitivity. Is is more expensive to make speakers with higher sensitivity?

Case in point, I own two pairs of speakers, one rated 88 dB and the other 91 dB. The 91 dB pair has an impedance of 8 ohms flat (according to the manufacturer) while the 88 dB pair has a nominal impedance of 6 ohms (not sure about dips). The difference is quite dramatic in terms of volume on my 180 watt tube amps. I often have to crank the volume way up to get sufficient loudness level in my rather small listening room (11x12) with the less efficient pair. That to me is crazy. The speakers are my fall-back pair from my digital past, and knowing how they behave, I'd never purchase them for my all-analog system today.

So as I'm thinking of upgrading my speakers, I'm quite perplexed about finding a speaker that would match well with my tube monoblocks - provide an easy load and good loudness level without strain. I've been considering giving Harbeths a shot, but I'm really turned off by their low sensitivity of 85 dB (30.1) and impedance of 6 ohms. How big an amp would I need if speakers with a sensitivity of 88 dB barely generate sufficient volume with 180 watts per channel?!

Can anyone explain in technical terms how tube amps handle speaker impedance and, secondarily, sensitivity? And perhaps more important from the practical standpoint - how does one select a speaker to match a tube amp?
actusreus
Out of curiousity, I called Paradigm to ask whether the S8s (my speakers) were designed to work best with SS or tube amps. The tech service rep said the S8s soak up current, as much as the amp can push out. In fact, he said SS was the way to go.

Now, . . . my amp is tube. Would my rig sound even better with a high quality SS amp, I rhetorically ask?? Maybe, just maybe. In the meantime, the rig sounds pretty good as is. I have a great subwoofer, which back-stops the fronts, so if I have low quality bass output, it's pretty well masked.
I have an Octave V70se (70w @ 4ohm) driving Dyn C1 Signatures (85db) and I can turn it up a lot louder than I can stand. Not because it's fatiguing but because for me it's jut too loud. That being said the Octave was designed for 4 ohm speaker and more important the Dyn is very stable at 4ohm. Now my son had Klipsch KLF30's (103db) and holy cr@p could they get loud. With either his Bryston 3Bsst or my Octave. But all I can say good about the KLF's is they could get super loud. Couldn't stand the sound except at super super low volumes. But in general when comparing anything side by side louder will win 95% of the time (short term comparisons).

So would a SS amp sound better. Yes with the right amp. I'd take a Burmester 956 over the Octave V70SE any day. But my Bryston B100sst and my sons 3Bsst were not as good sounding as the Octave V70se with the Dyn's.

But with tubes you can swap them out any change up the sound a bit (warmer - more musical or more linear and detailed).

Last I believe specs are a very general guideline. Any 2 pieces of equipment with the same specs will sound quite different. It's all about system synergy.
Xtil6 - Right and agreed. My Q is how many B&M stores really know how to mix and match, especially when there's an inherent bias (pun) that they will sell what they have.
Not many - but only the good ones. I think all dealers try their best but sometimes profit margin or price point (lower) means more sales. Well established dealers have been though it. Took my local dealer a couple of years to get it. Now that is his strong point. Total system synergy. But it does come with a price.
Actusreus wrote: "I would like to hear a speaker designer's point of view regarding this common tendency in speaker design. If designers such as John DeVore and Alan Yun (Silverline Audio) understand this quite well, why don't others?"

Because most audiophiles use solid state amps, most speaker designers don't bother with making their speakers tube-friendly. Which is fine by me, because it leaves a market niche for us little guys to exploit.

Paying a lot of attention to the impedance curve reduces your driver choices, and often makes crossover design more challenging. I could probably get away with about 1/3 to maybe 1/2 fewer components in my crossovers if I didn't mind a roller-coaster impedance curve. Also as noted already, high efficiency + decent bass extension = a big box. With audio in general moving towards small-box speakers for aesthetics, big, tube-friendly speakers are going against the grain.

While impedance dips can reduce the real-world power that a tube amp can deliver, impedance peaks can be bad too because of their effect on the frequency response (assuming the speaker was designed for "voltage paradigm" solid-state amps). Let me explain:

Suppose we have an "8-ohm speaker" with twin impedance peaks in the bass region that rise to 16 ohms, and a 32-ohm peak at the crossover frequency of 2.5 kHz. At a level equal to "1 watt into 8 ohms" a solid-state amp will be delivering 1/2 watt into those bass impedance peaks, and 1/4 watt into that 32-ohm peak at the crossover frequency. If the speaker was voiced for a solid state amp, then what happens on a tube amp is this: You get 3 dB more output into the bass impedance peaks (which can make the bass sound underdamped), and you get about 6 dB more output in the crossover region (which makes the speaker sound forward and fatiguing). Your instinct would be to blame the tube amp and conclude that tube amps are "fat and forward" because the speaker sounded fine on the solid state amp, but the real culprit is the speaker's impedance curve.

The approach I take to the impedance curve is to keep it fairly high and with no significant peaks north of the bass region, so that the spectral balance doesn't change with amplifier type. To deal with the effects of the bass impedance peaks, I tune the box considerably lower than is theoretically "optimum", so that the region boosted by the port is moved down lower in frequency. The net effect is more extended bass than we normally would have gotten, without excess upper-bass thickness. This is as close to a "free lunch" as it gets, but it's only a "free lunch" when contrasted with the same speaker on a solid state amp. (Actually my port lengths are user-adjustable, for compatibility with the various amplifier types).

In my opinion the high efficiency and benign impedance curves that make for a tube-friendly speaker are generally beneficial regardless of amplifier type, so the main drawback is the larger box size imposed by the requirement for higher efficiency.

Of course mine is by no means the only legitimate approach to designing a tube-friendly speaker. The designer can let the impedance curve do whatever and simply voice the speaker for tube amps.

I've done some over-simplifying in this post, but hopefully given enough information to illustrate some of the considerations on the designer's side of the fence.

Duke
dealer/manufacturer
Duke (Audiokinesis) - thanks for that cogent explanation. However, it riases a bunch of other questions for me.

First is, when a speaker manufacturer publishes frequency response specs, how can they possibly apply to BOTH tube and SS amps at the same time. Unless the amp in someway can sense the change in impedance and adjust its power output when encountering impedance curves, peaks and valleys, how is it possible for a speaker that is designed for a SS amp to have a flat FR if a tube amp is used, and vice versa of course?

Second, if the answer is "SS is SS and tube is tube, and never the twain shall meet (pun - LOL)," isn't it a bit of a misrepresenation on the speaker manufacturer's part not to mention that its published stats only apply in the case of [blank] type amps and that results can vary if [other blank] type amps are used?

I bet that most speakers on the market today have roller coaster impedance curves. I think I read somewher that Wilson speakers have pretty wild curves here and there too, but are also considered tube friendly. I understand that ARC uses Wilsons to check the sound of it amps.

So I guess the bottom line is what is the consumer supposed to do to make an informed decision when mixing and matching components??

Thanks for your cogent response. Hopefully we'll be hearing from some the EE/tech types too.