Is There A Big Difference Between Subwoofers From Different Manufacturers

@ieales

It’s simple to add a first order passive HP to roll the lows out of the mains.

Are you speaking about a line-level HP filter like the Vandersteen M7-HP High-Pass Filter? If that is so easy or simple, then why does the M7-HP appear to consist of multiple components assembled on a circuit board at a price of $3,300/pair?

I am not challenging your comment but rather trying to understand. The quality of a line-level HP filter is so important because the entire signal going to the main speakers passes through it. I doubt the HP filters provided in most subs are of a sufficient quality to handle that task without affecting the sound of the main signal in some way. The M7-HP filter (i.e., balanced line-level) is exactly what I need except I would want the pass frequency at 50Hz instead of 100Hz, and I would like to pay less than $3,300.

Based on the sonic benefit of relieving the main amplifier of reproducing the lowest level signals when subs are used, I am surprised there are not more aftermarket products like the Vandersteen filters or more information about how to construct a high pass filter using high quality parts.  At least one manufacturer includes a HP filter input in their amplifiers - the Aesthetix Atlas, but I know nothing about the quality of that filter.  Do you know of any websites where I might learn more about constructing a line-level filter like the M7-HP?

The room becomes less of a factor the more subs you add. With a swarm (4 subs) the room becomes almost a non issue.

No it doesn’t. The work done by Toole is for even bass everywhere, not accurate bass anywhere.

It’s simple to add a first order passive HP to roll the lows out of the mains.

Are you speaking about a line-level HP filter like the Vandersteen M7-HP High-Pass Filter?

No, an inline filter between pre- and power amps. THERE SHOULD BE NOTHING BUT WIRE BETWEEN THE POWER AMP OUT AND THE LS DRIVER TERMINALS. If everyone would multi-amp, the world would be a better place... and a lot of cable controversy would evaporate. I shudder every time I think about rollercoaster speaker phase response. 😢 Doubly so when tube amps are mentioned. The math makes my head spin. 😕

I have a small system near field listening with Canton 9k 2 way stand mounted so I purchased an SVS sb 1000 pro before the price increase. I emailed Canton in Germany and asked the best frequency range to set the cross over and they got back to me the next day (impressive between 50 and 60 hz 24 dB roll-off  ) I do not have the luxury to do the craw to optimize the placement of the sub they sit next to the cantons. Why, my family considerations hold sway on placement and size and I suspect in most homes this is true the tail does not wag the dog.

the SVS app has quite a bit of flexibility and control ( read about it) and you make changes at your listening position (sweet). The sub can be easily and seamlessly integrated with the Cantons.

Having said all this what I experience is dictated by what's playing upstream that is to say some CDs have great bass other CDs not so much. Consequently, my sub can sound boomy and muddy as well as crisp and tight based on the CD being played.  Be that as it may, in all cases the SVS sb1000 pro  is a bit underpowered currently set at 9+ out of 10 on its power output. I should have gotten the next size up but again I was told no big ugly boxes and you spent how much on those things. Ah, the price of domestic tranquility.

@ieales - Maybe I do not understand.

The Vandersteen M7-HP is in fact "an inline filter between pre- and power amps". It has an XLR input and output and is intended to be situated between the preamp and the power amp. The purpose would be to roll off the bass frequencies before they are sent to be amplified by the main amplifier and sent to the main speakers. A separate full-frequency line-level feed would then be sent from the preamp to the line level inputs on the subwoofers where their internal low-pass filter would determine the HF cut-off. In essence, this type of set-up is multi-amping because you have one amplifier powering the main speakers and the internal subwoofer amplifiers powering the subs.

After having read most of the posts regarding subs and despite what mijostyn wrote about REL subs, I can state unequivocally that the one thing almost everybody seems to agree on in this forum is that REL subs are very good. A negative comment about REL subs is very, very rare. And this comes from someone who does not own an REL sub myself, I own the Bower and Wilkens PV1D, which is a two bass driver design that delivers quite a bit of punch.