Amir and Blind Testing


Let me start by saying I like watching Amir from ASR, so please let’s not get harsh or the thread will be deleted. Many times, Amir has noted that when we’re inserting a new component in our system, our brains go into (to paraphrase) “analytical mode” and we start hearing imaginary improvements. He has reiterated this many times, saying that when he switched to an expensive cable he heard improvements, but when he switched back to the cheap one, he also heard improvements because the brain switches from “music enjoyment mode” to “analytical mode.” Following this logic, which I agree with, wouldn’t blind testing, or any A/B testing be compromised because our brains are always in analytical mode and therefore feeding us inaccurate data? Seems to me you need to relax for a few hours at least and listen to a variety of music before your brain can accurately assess whether something is an actual improvement.  Perhaps A/B testing is a strawman argument, because the human brain is not a spectrum analyzer.  We are too affected by our biases to come up with any valid data.  Maybe. 

chayro

You cannot tune a room by blindfolding each step of your process...

You cannot fine tune sets of springs under and on top of each speakers damped by concrete load in my case, you cannot fine tune this at near 100 gram of precise loading weight blinfolded...

You cannot put in place 40 pieces of shungite and copper all along your electrical grid blind folded it is unnecessary to begins with...

And all others of my various devices like Schumann resonators grid i dontneed to be blindfolded to test it.... It is enough to set them off or on, each one at a times..And listen to the huge final difference...

Same process for my grid of different ionizers ....Samething for my other devices...

 

Blindtest is a tool for industrial reasearch yes and for marketing purpose also yes, it could be interesting to play with it in audiophile experience why not? it is fun yes...

But it is USELESS for my embeddings controls journey in mechanical,electrical and acoustical experiments in my own room...It will make my journey impossible to even start because of the complex burden which is related to scientific blind testing protocol.... 😁😊

It is ignorance to promote systematic blind test in audiophile tuning....Any audiophile can put off or put on something and listen and decide erroneously in some case but anyway being right in most cases... . It will be impossible anyway to blind test EVERYTHING...Perhaps some of my devices is not anything than a placebo effect for sure, but that did not explain the HUGE S.Q. improvement i enjoy now after many hundred of SMALL changes...

Our goal is creating a pleasurable acoustic experience of music in a system/room synergy for our own ears..

Our goal is not to set the OBJECTIVE standard for an industrial product where blind testing is a crucial step...

Objectivist and subjectivist division is a childish division who make no sense whatsoever in acoustic and in psycho-acoustic where only the correlation of each OBJECTIVE change or measure is CORRELATED under control by a guiding SUBJECTIVE judgment...

The important word here is not subjective nor objective but controlled correlation...

And blind test is a form of controlled correlation yes... But reducing all form of controlled correlation to thisone only is foolish... Especially in the incremental process of acoustic tuning of our room which may implicate many hundred of small changes by listening experiments...

 

 

For The measures problem: all is measurable in principle but we cannot measures all that can be measured or all that must be measured  anyway and in some case we dont know what to measure... And anyway no one has the same ears/brain history and stuctural working... We differ... Then to set a room and tuning it  measures are necessary but are only tags all along the road not the road itself...

The analytical mind isn't binary.  It's not on vs. off, but more a matter of degrees.  Sometimes the mind, regardless of listening mode, has a clearly formed opinion and other times things are kind of opaque.  All of which leads me to believe that most "upgrades" are subtle.

If it takes you months to make an evaluation, then I think it's just as much a reflection of your mind and body's movement over time than the actual change in your system.  Your weight, blood pressure, eating habits, sleep patterns, sexual activity, exercise, drug usage (both medicinal and recreational), illness, etc. all have a direct bearing upon what you think and how you feel about the sound of music.

Does the system change make a difference?  Do you like the difference?  The words of the poet illuminate:

First there is a mountain, then there is no mountain, then there is.

It is nice to know your gear measures reasonably well.  For example, over the years I have come to realize I seem to like the sound of amplifiers that double (or almost) power from 8 ohms to 4 ohms.  Also, having a DAC with a high’ish S/N ratio is typically a good thing.  However in the context of a home audio system, what really matters is how things sound to you when you have it all put together.  I agree with those who leave new stuff in their system for a relatively long time and then take the new stuff out, put things back the way they were, and then listen some more, rather than doing quicker A/B listening comparisons.  I also believe level matching is important and actually critical when doing shorter A/B comparisons.  In cases of subtle differences resulting from tweaks, doodads, and cables, I mostly try not to sweat it and ultimately decide whether the item is even worth the money.  The cognitive bias involved in all of this is directly proportional to the amount of audio forums and equipment reviews the listener reads.

All of which leads me to believe that most "upgrades" are subtle.

You need to make bigger jumps with your upgrades. 

Don't forget also that Confirmation Bias works in both directions.

Your brain can "confirm" improvements it expects to hear.

Your brain can also "confirm" that you don't expect to hear any audible improvements.