Rel vs the world


So whenever you look for subwoofer recommendations for 2 channel hifi, one name keeps dominating the conversation.. rel. And the flagship no 25 is seen as the ultimate subwoofer by many. My question is, has anyone compared well made but more affordable subwoofers (JTR, PSA, Rhythmik) to rel subwoofers (especially no 25) and go equally good or better results with the more affordable subwoofers?
Also thoughts on effects of cone material on sound in subwoofers? I am very interested in the choice of using carbon fiber cones on speakers like Alon in Magicos and Michael Borresen in his speakers. When I saw this in the rel no 25 I wondered if that was one of the reasons people were impressed with its performance. I found this article that Tom from PSA sent me pretty interesting.
"Myth: Cone Material Affects the "Timbre" of Subwoofers

At low frequencies, in the bass region below 125Hz, the cone material has no effect on the sound. If it did it would only be because of peripheral side effects such as a large change in the moving mass of the driver, or a cone who's strength and stiffness is deficient for the application allowing a lot of flex and distortion. A subwoofers cone or diaphragm should be stiff enough to not flex appreciably even when under heavy air loads. Any sufficiently stiff subwoofer cone would have resonances or breakup modes which are well beyond the bass range and should be inaudible with a typical low pass filter applied. If we have 3 identical sub drivers with different cone materials, one with an aluminum cone, one with a carbon fiber cone and another with a pressed paper cone and all are adequately stiff and the total moving mass of the driver is within a few percent of each other they will be indistinguishable from each other in a blind listening test.

The main take away here is that subwoofer cone material choice is primarily a consideration of strength/stiffness/durability/cosmetics/cost and weight. Sound is not one of those considerations.
"https://data-bass.com/#/articles/5cbf5e7357f7140004d6d0ec?_k=o4xuea


smodtactical
I've owned the Martin Logan Depth i, HSU, dual SVS SB Ultra 15s & 16s, dual JL Audio F110 v2s with their CR1 external crossover, JL Audio F112 v2, dual REL Carbon Limited, and now I have dual REL G1 MKII subwoofers. In my system I prefer RELs for 2-channel. RELs simply disappear in my system and you really don't know they're on, until you turn them off. In my opinion JL Audio hit harder, but I could never get either the F110s or F112 to disappear. If I required a subwoofer for HT only, I would choose SVS. If 50/50 music and HT I would choose JL Audio. For music and occasionally HT, RELs are my preferred subwoofers. 
@bjesien , If you a) have a dedicated room for music b) comfortable working with flatpacks/woodworking (a.k.a going the DIY route) c) don't mind the towering size (a.k.a very low WifeApprovalFactor), i would recommend the GR Research open baffle dipoles. It is hands down the best you can do for music, IMO. I have these in a dedicated 2 channel music room.

Otherwise, your next best option would be the sealed Rythmik F12G which have the GR research drivers. I use them for 80ish% music (20ish% movies) in a 5.2 setup with the Elac Adante series speakers. I use it for 2 channel and multichannel music (SACDs, blu-ray audio). For movies, i tend to crank up the sub levels on my receiver about 3 db and i have a 1 click setting for making the change. They dig real low btw and makes you feel things your soul's been craving all along (lol). I have not felt the need to try ported options just for movies.

With companies like SVS, REL, etc, you are also paying 40 to 50% of the cost to the dealer middleman for not doing much these days. Rythmik sells manufacturer direct and they are a Texas homegrown company. You tend to get better quality drivers etc at the same pricepoint. Our new political enterprise has been slapping tariffs on European imports as well. So, you may be paying that in your price on some imports these days too (not too sure). This becomes a contentious topic, so i'll leave it there. With Rythmiks, you also get more DOFs (variable phase, peq, etc) for better manual integration if you don't have bass management. Don't let anyone tell you that manual integration is a easy peasy thing to do and the RELs do it just so seamlessly. It is simply not true and proper integration takes a significant amount of measurements, time and effort. As a music guy mostly, I have been hitting my head with frustration on various subwoofers i've owned for 20 years. Long story short, my frustration has ended and i'm extremely happy and content after my Rythmik+GR research discovery. This is my personal experience. Other forum opinions/experiences may differ, of course.

Don't let anyone tell you that manual integration is a easy peasy thing to do and the RELs do it just so seamlessly. It is simply not true

Maybe it didn't work that way for you, in your room, with your system.  It did for me.

The Rythmiks might be fantastic subs.  If I tried them, I might like them even better than RELs.  I simply have no idea; I've never heard them.  Regardless, there was nothing in what I said about my experience integrating REL subs that is "simply not true."  Following the manual process outlined by REL gave me, and apparently others, results I am extremely happy with. 

Acoustics is hard.  Perceived acoustics, even harder.  Anybody's mileage may vary.  But "simply not true" is just rude and silly.
@trentmemphis, Ah yes, the longstanding REL marketing magic of "seamless integration" like no other sub out there apparently! I guess the power of suggestion can work wonders too...Make some other guy who spent years with it look rude and silly (when i said it was my personal experience and there may be differing opinions/experiences).

Either way, good for you.