Speaker shootout update; aggressive treble eliminating some (fairly?)

Hi HLD,

I have the Fritz Rev Carbon 7 mk II, I also have had the Fritz Carbon 7, Fritz Rev 5, and the first Fritz Carrera. None of these speakers are bright and all of them have something very unique about their sound. The Fritz Carrera Be May be something you want to take a look at. It has even more detail then Carbon 7 mk II (but is less bright) better sound stage depth and extension, and has a midrange that is lush, magical, and rich. It also can be driven by a few watts... Fritz even demoed it with a Tube Headphone amp at one the shows. 
Under $4000 your not gonna find a speaker you like more if you have and eversion to bright treble. The Dynaudio that you are going to try will be probably have less magic in the midrange but you will like the mechanical nature of its control and prat. Be forewarned though as they require amplification that cost a lot more ( the Fritz speaker responds well to pretty much any amp). If you are entertaining the thought of the special 40 you may be disappointed in its midrange as they really skimped on the crossover. 

@audioconnection

I feel your pain because many of my customers complain about the same thing....

Hi John,

ProAcs like tube amps, noting you also sell ProAc too, and Quicksilver amps. Perhaps something like a Proac D20 type smallish 2-way 8ohm floorstanders, w/soft dome. Perhaps another match with Hilde45’s QS Mono 60 KT88 amps, what say you - your thoughts?

Hi @ditusa — I have that right now. (At least an absorbent blanket.)
@djverne Thanks for the suggestion. I think my Quicksilver Monos will have the juice needed for the 88 db Dyns, but we'll see. No cost experiment.

Some 244 or 242 panels above your speakers will help a little bit.  
Your issue is that you are sensitive to overly bright speakers.  If you go dyns, try to get something with the esotar tweeter, not the esotec.  I’m not sure that you have enough power to make the dyns sing though.

The Carbon 7’s you’ve been listening to have a nice Scan Speak air circ soft dome tweeter.  It will probably be on par with just about any other soft domes out there.

The BE tweeter is going to offer up lots more detail without being harsh or overly bright.  I’m very similar in that I can not stand hard domes but at the same time I love Beryllium.

I would even go so far as to say that if you do end up not liking the salks, which I highly doubt, the Fritz Carrera BE’s may be your ticket.  They will play very nicely with your tubes and they have an awesome, natural organic sound with great air and detail up top.

Something to take into consideration, and something that others here are more knowledgeable about than I, when an impedance curve drops dowm from 8 ohms to 4 ohms, if your amp doesn’t double down in power (100 watts at 8 ohms, 200 watts at 4 ohms), it will make the speaker sound bright.

Honestly, the Fritz Carreras are probably the best speakers for your tastes.  If you aren’t smitten with the Salks, have Fritz send you a pair of Carreras.

Lastly, you really should strap on some headphones and google frequency sweeps.  Check your hearing to see whats going on.  Doing that was a real eye, er, ear opener for me.  The sweep should stay the same volume and centered throughout the range.  For me, I have hearing loss in my right ear through a certain range but I am also highly sensitive to 2khz, 6khz and 10khz with no hearing above 15khz.

I remember when we first started talking months ago that I had recommended that you check out Monitor Audio Golds with the ribbon tweeters.  I think that might be something else you look at.  They are very detailed while being laid back as well.  They are beautiful and built extremely well too.  Theres some gold gx 200’s in parker for sale on C-list.  Maybe you can arrange an audition.

I really think though that they soft domes aren’t going to get you the detail that you are after.  You will need to go Beryllium, amt, ribbon or planar.  The nice thing about ribbon and planar is that the limited vertical dispersion will actually be beneficial for you with your lower ceilings.  

@b_limo 
It's not at all clear that I'm sensitive to overly-bright speakers.
For one, if they're "overly bright" then *anyone* would be sensitive. So, it's not uniquely me. (And others hearing these in my room have also flinched at how bright they were.)
Second, the room has 6.5 foot ceilings. As many have deduced, this indicates that it may not be that the speakers are overly bright. It's the room is causing the issue.
All that said, a soft-dome may be the right thing for anyone who had my room.
Doing some hearing tests would be good. It very well could be me, but doing it outside of the strange acoustics of my room would help.

You wrote:

I really think though that they soft domes aren’t going to get you the detail that you are after. You will need to go Beryllium, amt, ribbon or planar. The nice thing about ribbon and planar is that the limited vertical dispersion will actually be beneficial for you with your lower ceilings.

My suspicion is really that *any* tower is probably overloading the room. I bet I could get any speaker and as long as it's right sized (and I'm sitting at the proper, lower, height) it could work.

In other words, I've put too large speakers, too high up in a room with low ceilings. I've created an acoustic challenge that makes it seem to be about the material the tweeter are made of — but that is just a small part of the equation. That is what a bunch of the really smart comments on this thread add up to, as I synthesize them.